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Lobo316
Ulthal
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:03 am Posts: 672
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 Ghouls...just curious
How come the ghoul touch in C&C lasts for turns, as opposed to rounds? Looking at the D&D 2nd edition printing of the ghoul, it was rounds.
Just curious if anyone had taken note of this and if you are running it "by the book" (as printed in M&T) or if you house-ruled it to rounds.
Me, I made it rounds. I like the suspense it creates when a player is sitting there on pins and needle wondering if he is going to get a chance to get back into the fight. Make it turns pretty much removes that suspense.
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Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:04 pm |
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Omote
Battle Stag
Joined: Wed May 03, 2006 7:00 am Posts: 11494 Location: The fairest view in the park, Ohio.
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
Due to an ugly situation with players many years ago, I have also changed the paralyzing touch of the ghoul to rounds. Not that I WANTED to, but 6 or 7 PCs of 2-3rd level were nearly TPK'd by a band of 4 ghouls! Bad dice rolls will kill ya good. At one point the entire party was paralyzed at the same time. The players were aggravated to no end, but as the PCs were about to be devoured two of the PCs were unparalyzed because I, on the fly, changed the paralyze to rounds instead of minutes.
Unfortunately, now that I have done that, the players have come to think that all ghouls paralyze for rounds instead of minutes.
And if any of my players are reading this... GET READY TO FEEL THE STING!~
~O
_________________ @-Duke Omote Landwehr, Holy Order of the FPQ ~ Prince of the Castles & Crusades Society-@ VAE VICTUS! >> Omote's Advanced C&C stuff <<
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Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:52 pm |
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Lobo316
Ulthal
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:03 am Posts: 672
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
LOL, nice Omote, as always. I do think that is the right call though. It certainly does not make ghouls any less frightening, and personally, I like having them more "available" (lack of a better word). Making it turns means you really gotta be careful when throwing them out there, but still....even with rounds, ouch, they are still very scary to face.
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Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:57 pm |
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Frost
Beer Giant Jarl
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2007 8:00 am Posts: 1325 Location: Pittsburgh, PA
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
So is "turns" right by the book though?
_________________ Lord Frost Baron of the Pitt Castles & Crusades Society The Dungeoneering Dad
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Tue Apr 03, 2012 2:42 am |
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Omote
Battle Stag
Joined: Wed May 03, 2006 7:00 am Posts: 11494 Location: The fairest view in the park, Ohio.
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
Yes. Turns (minutes) would seem to be correct. It's been that way through 3 printings. Serl would be the only one to say for sure.
~O
_________________ @-Duke Omote Landwehr, Holy Order of the FPQ ~ Prince of the Castles & Crusades Society-@ VAE VICTUS! >> Omote's Advanced C&C stuff <<
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Tue Apr 03, 2012 3:01 am |
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serleran
Mogrl
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 7:00 am Posts: 13723
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
The AD&D ghoul, as was the source of much inspiration for C&C creaturedom, lists no duration for the paralysis. So turns was a sort of compromise... between infinite and 'over before you realize it.' 2nd edition AD&D was never consulted for anything.
_________________ -----------
^ Ignore.
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Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:23 am |
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redwullf
Ulthal
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2011 9:28 pm Posts: 651
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
OSRIC measures the paralysis in 3d4 turns, LL in 2d4 turns, BFRPG in 2d8 turns, D&D RC in 2d4 turns (and, equally, Dark Dungeons in "2d4x10 minutes"), and 3e in 1d4+1 rounds.
So, the OSR versions at least agree on turns, but SRD measures in mere rounds. In short, it seems to have been widely agreed that the Ghoul touch paralyzes for several turns throughout most of the game's history, until 3e.
_________________
 "The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs. He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own.” -- E. G. G. -------------------------------------------------- Castles & Crusades Society Member
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Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:19 pm |
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Lobo316
Ulthal
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:03 am Posts: 672
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
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redwullf wrote:
OSRIC measures the paralysis in 3d4 turns, LL in 2d4 turns, BFRPG in 2d8 turns, D&D RC in 2d4 turns (and, equally, Dark Dungeons in "2d4x10 minutes"), and 3e in 1d4+1 rounds.
So, the OSR versions at least agree on turns, but SRD measures in mere rounds. In short, it seems to have been widely agreed that the Ghoul touch paralyzes for several turns throughout most of the game's history, until 3e.
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Not quite, the 2e version was measured in rounds... http://www.lomion.de/cmm/ghoul.php
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Tue Apr 03, 2012 1:50 pm |
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Lobo316
Ulthal
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:03 am Posts: 672
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
You know, the more I think about it, why limit ourselves to one ruling on this. Lower HD ghouls paralyze for rounds, while more foul, more powerful (ie, higher HD) ghouls paralyze for for longer durations, even lasting turns.
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Tue Apr 03, 2012 2:49 pm |
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Arduin
Greater Lore Drake
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2011 6:12 pm Posts: 4054 Location: Granite quarry
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
Measuring the effect in minutes rather than mere seconds seems more reasonable.
_________________ Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill
House Rules
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Tue Apr 03, 2012 4:10 pm |
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Lobo316
Ulthal
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:03 am Posts: 672
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
I'm not sure I agree with that, as a general rule (nothing wrong with it though). Ghouls are mythical creatures, there is no precendent to say "Oh yea, when a Ghoul claws you, you cannot move for X mins or X seconds. I could play under either ruling. Heck, I can run it either way.
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Tue Apr 03, 2012 9:43 pm |
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Arduin
Greater Lore Drake
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2011 6:12 pm Posts: 4054 Location: Granite quarry
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
Just going by the original rules for them. That's as close to a precedent as you'll get for game rules.
_________________ Old age and treachery will overcome youth and skill
House Rules
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Wed Apr 04, 2012 1:08 am |
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redwullf
Ulthal
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2011 9:28 pm Posts: 651
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
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Lobo316 wrote:
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redwullf wrote:
OSRIC measures the paralysis in 3d4 turns, LL in 2d4 turns, BFRPG in 2d8 turns, D&D RC in 2d4 turns (and, equally, Dark Dungeons in "2d4x10 minutes"), and 3e in 1d4+1 rounds.
So, the OSR versions at least agree on turns, but SRD measures in mere rounds. In short, it seems to have been widely agreed that the Ghoul touch paralyzes for several turns throughout most of the game's history, until 3e.
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Not quite, the 2e version was measured in rounds... http://www.lomion.de/cmm/ghoul.php
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Ah, you're right, the one version I didn't check. 2e...always the oddball.
_________________
 "The worthy GM never purposely kills players' PCs. He presents opportunities for the rash and unthinking players to do that all on their own.” -- E. G. G. -------------------------------------------------- Castles & Crusades Society Member
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Wed Apr 04, 2012 11:55 am |
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Lobo316
Ulthal
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2011 2:03 am Posts: 672
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
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redwullf wrote:
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Lobo316 wrote:
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redwullf wrote:
OSRIC measures the paralysis in 3d4 turns, LL in 2d4 turns, BFRPG in 2d8 turns, D&D RC in 2d4 turns (and, equally, Dark Dungeons in "2d4x10 minutes"), and 3e in 1d4+1 rounds.
So, the OSR versions at least agree on turns, but SRD measures in mere rounds. In short, it seems to have been widely agreed that the Ghoul touch paralyzes for several turns throughout most of the game's history, until 3e.
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Not quite, the 2e version was measured in rounds... http://www.lomion.de/cmm/ghoul.php
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Ah, you're right, the one version I didn't check. 2e...always the oddball.
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LOL!
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Wed Apr 04, 2012 4:03 pm |
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Relaxo
Greater Lore Drake
Joined: Wed Mar 19, 2008 7:00 am Posts: 3351
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
Why split hairs? the paralysis lasts until they EAT YOU
_________________ Bill D. Author: Yarr! Rules-Light Pirate RPG BD Games - www.playBDgames.com http://rpg.drivethrustuff.com/browse.ph ... rs_id=5781
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Thu Apr 05, 2012 1:00 am |
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zombiehands
Hlobane Orc
Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2007 8:00 am Posts: 144
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 Re: Ghouls...just curious
I really like minutes instead of rounds. It makes them very scarey indeed. I recently ran a game where the players moved around a dungeon full of ghouls like people in zombie apocolypse game. If was very fun.
_________________ There are two novels that can change a 14-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs. John Rogers
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Wed Jun 13, 2012 12:47 pm |
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