TLG 8015 Castle Keepers Guide

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Christina Stiles
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Post by Christina Stiles »

Piperdog wrote:
This is good news indeed.

9 has been handed back. Tim's got 10, and I have 11. 19 is inching closer.
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Post by dachda »

Christina Stiles wrote:
I can assure you that chapters of the text exist and are being edited and sent to layout. I see no reason to doubt there will be an actual book when we are very close and the Trolls do their own printing.

Is it true doubt or just trolling for some angry responses hoping to start a flame war here?
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Post by ozchandler »

riddle me this batgirl; will it contain an alternative skill system to the siege engine?

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Post by Christina Stiles »

ozchandler wrote:
riddle me this batgirl; will it contain an alternative skill system to the siege engine?

I personally haven't seen such a section, but I haven't seen all the files at this point. Hopefully, Steve will come by to answer that question for you.

Btw, you guys should convince Steve to post a sneak peek at the book's Table of Contents. Things could change slightly, but that might answer some questions and let you know what you have to look forward to.
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Post by serleran »

I don't believe there is a Steve.
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Post by Go0gleplex »

Crack a Dr. Pepper and he will come...
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Post by Piperdog »

Quote:
I don't believe there is a Steve.

I nearly spit my coffee all over the laptop! lol.
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Post by BLOOD AXE »

I check this forum from time to time to look at the CKG progress.

You gotta be kidding me...this still isnt ready yet?
It took less time to write War & Peace.
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Post by Go0gleplex »

BLOOD AXE wrote:
It took less time to write War & Peace.

Yeah...and looked at how THAT turned out.
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Post by BLOOD AXE »

Ive just been waiting 2 years. Has it really been that long or does it just seem that way....
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Post by Treebore »

Editing is well over half done and layout is about half done, so not much longer now.

Some of us have been waiting nearly 5 years, and I held the original version in my hands in July of 2009.
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Post by BLOOD AXE »

Well hopefully soon.....
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Post by Coleston the Cavalier »

I pre-ordered my copy!
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Post by Sir Osis of Liver »

Coleston the Cavalier wrote:
I pre-ordered my copy!

As have I. Hoping it'll be out before Christmas, but if not, it's not. If worse comes to worse, I can just have Steve bring my copy with him to GaryCon.

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Post by ozchandler »

it's more likely that Steve will bring your CKG copy with him to GENCON. The real question is will it be in 2011 or 2012
This book has been delayed for several years due to a perfectionist attitude toward quality editing, which means there shouldn't be a single typo in the book. I would've taken a few typos to have gotten the book at GENCON 2010 as alluded to in past post from the trolls.

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Post by GameOgre »

Quote:
This book has been delayed for several years due to a perfectionist attitude toward quality editing

Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!
Quote:
which means there shouldn't be a single typo in the book

Errr, are we talking about the same Trolls? You know, there might be a reason that they are called Trolls right? It isn't the green skin or the horrid toenails...
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Post by ozchandler »

yep, the same trolls. i've met them and they're very nice people, but aggravating when it comes to the CKG (which btw should include an "official", but optional skill system alternative to the siege engine).

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Post by Treebore »

ozchandler wrote:
it's more likely that Steve will bring your CKG copy with him to GENCON. The real question is will it be in 2011 or 2012
This book has been delayed for several years due to a perfectionist attitude toward quality editing, which means there shouldn't be a single typo in the book. I would've taken a few typos to have gotten the book at GENCON 2010 as alluded to in past post from the trolls.

Typos will always happen, there isn't a single RPG book out there that doesn't have errors in it.
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Post by Piperdog »

Quote:
Typos will always happen, there isn't a single RPG book out there that doesn't have errors in it.

Preach it, Miller.
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Post by Go0gleplex »

ozchandler wrote:
it's more likely that Steve will bring your CKG copy with him to GENCON. The real question is will it be in 2011 or 2012

Given the progress and effort put into getting this out, now that they have had the time and open slate, this comes off as just petulantly snarky whether or not it was intended as such.
ozchandler wrote:
This book has been delayed for several years due to a perfectionist attitude toward quality editing...

Actually...editting has had nothing to do with getting it done other than the last few months when Steve has given it over to the editors. The book has always been an optional item...and was pre-empted by such great things as CZ: The Upper Works and many of Gary's books...on top of other issues. Of course, this has all been said several times before in other threads. That an operation with such limited manpower has been able to produce as much as it has deserves some respect. Not derision because they can't keep to someone else's assumptive schedule. Hell, I challenge anyone to do better given the exact set of circumstance if they're so all fired miffed about a non-essential book being delayed a while. While I'm bummed it isn't in my hand yet, I'll take the zen road...it'll be what it'll be to get it to good quality.

(end rant)
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Post by ozchandler »

meant to be snarky? nope

meant to show aggravation? yep

do all rpg books have at least 1 typo or gramatical error? yep

will years of writing and editing prevent them? probably not

fans coming to the defense of a company teasing them for years? priceless

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Post by BLOOD AXE »

Coleston the Cavalier wrote:
I pre-ordered my copy!

I didnt. I wont preorder and pay for something with no guarantee when it will be finished and delivered.

I just wish the CKG was made more of a priority. Many other books were produced during the work on the CKG.

Its just frustrating. I hope the wait is worth it.
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Post by Sir Osis of Liver »

ozchandler wrote:
yep, the same trolls. i've met them and they're very nice people, but aggravating when it comes to the CKG (which btw should include an "official", but optional skill system alternative to the siege engine).

This cracks me up whenever I see it rear its ugly head from time to time. Why does there need to be an "official" skill system? Why do you need hard-and-fast canon in a rulebook to be able to play the game the way you want to? If you want skills, put them in your game. Keep your 3.x rulebooks at the table, in addition to your C&C stuff, and skill away to your heart's content. Personally, I've found my experience at the game table to be far more rewarding when I was able to spend less time on bookkeeping and more time on actual roleplaying. I've found skills to be great for min-maxing characters. I'm happy to be playing a game, however, that relies less on a player's ability to build the optimal set of numbers and can instead focus on role-playing that character through a variety of situations.

As I recall, there was an optional skills system that was introduced with the CZ materials. If that's what you want, adopt it. If you want to use what some other publisher did along those lines, run with it. Why does it have to be canon, however, when the intent of the game (as I understand it) was to minimize the amount of extraneous bookkeeping that came out with 3.x. I prefer my characters to be limited not by what's on the sheet of paper in terms of skills and numbers, but instead by my own imagination. If you like your skills, houserule them in. Personally, I don't want my game books to be loaded with all that stuff when there are other things I'd like to see.

And I'll be as patient as I have to be for the CKG. I've pre-ordered it, knowing full well that if something were to happen that would prevent the Trolls from getting it out in a timely enough manner, they're good enough people that they'd at least let me know what's going on and, if need be, hopefully would offer to refund my money (or they'd at least do so if I asked them to). I'll deal with them over any of the other publishers in the FRPG biz currently any day of the week.

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Post by Rhuvein »

I look forward to seeing the book released!
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Post by Vetterix »

Does anyone know if there will be more information / general rules on spell research in the CKG (as the PHB is short on this) ?
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Post by anglefish »

Go0gleplex wrote:
That an operation with such limited manpower ...

Like hiring a freelancer writer and/or editor.

The trolls raised the capital for a whole print shop, if I've understood right. There's quite a few talented individuals who (Matt Forebeck) who write books like this is a day. (Considering that he has triplets, he's motivated.)

-- oh. And when I'm reading the Crusader, I'm thinking "Write less vanity fiction and do more CKG writing/editing."

Though this ain't the first time, though, I've seen a company put off a fan favorite because they don't deem it "a priority.

Paradigm Concepts put off their lizard man book for ages because the staff weren't excited about the race ... yet they had solid data (their RPGA living campaign) that stated the lizard men were the most popular race.

Sometimes a company has to be quick on it's feet and see that the customer is giving feedback for a new opportunity and re-prioritize.

In the Trolls defense, I'll agree that's much easier said than done.

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Post by Deogolf »

BLOOD AXE wrote:
I didnt. I wont preorder and pay for something with no guarantee when it will be finished and delivered.

I just wish the CKG was made more of a priority. Many other books were produced during the work on the CKG.

Its just frustrating. I hope the wait is worth it.

Please, let's not go down that road again. Everyone knows the story on the CKG. Other books were done so that the CKG could live! I look forward to seeing what it looks like!!
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Post by Piperdog »

Ohhhhhh Christiiiiiinnnnaaaaa!

How's it goin'?
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Post by Troll Lord »

ozchandler wrote:
riddle me this batgirl; will it contain an alternative skill system to the siege engine?

No. There is nothing in the book that replaces the Siege Engine. There is a skill system in the book, that uses the Siege Engine.

Steve
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Progress

Post by Troll Lord »

Chapters 10, 12 and 13 have landed on my desk and will go to layout today. The remaining chapters are with Christina and Tim in the editing process. There are 19 in all and of these remaining six four are relatively short.

Peter has laid out through chapter 9 and is including art now.

Final editing is through chapter 5, with 6 and 7 going to the look over today (the 1st of December).

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