Protection from evil/good/etc. clarification needed

Open Discussion on all things C&C from new product to general questions to the rules, the laws, and the chaos.
Post Reply
User avatar
Posts: 412
Joined: Fri May 12, 2006 7:00 am

Protection from evil/good/etc. clarification needed

Post by bighara »

From 3rd P. PHB"

"The spell prevents bodily contact by all summoned or conjured creatures of any alignment: the melee attacks of such creatures fail and the creatures recoil from the protective magic. The protection against contact by summoned or conjured creatures ends if the warded creature makes an attack against, or tries to force the barrier against, the blocked creature."

(emphasis mine)

With things like undead, what counts as a summoned/conjured creature? A skeleton can be created via Animate Dead, is that a conjuration or summoning? What about a ghost or vampire?
“Style is the perfection of a point of view.”

User avatar
Posts: 5284
Joined: Sat May 27, 2006 7:00 am
Location: East Texas

Post by DangerDwarf »

If it is summoned by a "Summon BIg Ol' Critter", it is summoned. If some mad cultists drew out some profane circle of conjuration and called forth a demon from the Nebulous Pits of Rah! it is conjured.

Animated skeletons are just that...animated.

Ghost and vampires? if they were called forth by a summon creepy Undead thingy sepll, then I'd say sure. otherwise nothey ar enot summoned, conjured or whatever.

Posts: 15
Joined: Thu Feb 12, 2009 8:00 am

Post by ghostSmacker »

I'm with DD on this.

Animate Undead and Create Undead are necromantic spells and effects. Conjuration magic and summoned creatures come from things like Summon Monster, Gate, Bag of Tricks etc.

Two totally different things in my opinion.

User avatar
Renegade Mage
Posts: 3735
Joined: Fri Jul 07, 2006 7:00 am
Location: Montreal, Canada

Post by moriarty777 »

Hmm... interesting.

I've not really noticed before and I think this is where I'm curious about previous editions and how they word or treat it.

However, I think I understand the context of it. A medieval magician would summon a 'spirit' to appear before him outside a 'circle of protection' which is essentially a circle inscribed and empowered by various divine names. I'm vastly simplifying things here but, by extension, if we carry this logic into the game and kept it within this context, a circle of protection would not protect against a vampire. It could protect you against an elemental though. You also have to consider that C&C does not use schools as such so anything 'brought forth' could be considered as summoned (if they were pre-existing) or conjured (if they were created).

"You face Death itself in the form of... 1d4 Tarrasques!"

Partner to Brave Halfling Publishing

User avatar
Posts: 5284
Joined: Sat May 27, 2006 7:00 am
Location: East Texas

Post by DangerDwarf »

I think the vagueness of stuff like this is a necessity. Absolutes don't always work in an RPG.

This is a prime example of something that should be left to CK adjudication through common sense on a case by case basis.

If the ghost is some haunting boogie man who's been roaming the Castle Slackmoore for centuries, the CK should feel free to adjudicate that it is not summoned or conjured. However, should the recently widowed witch call forth fell magics to have the spirit of her party-slain husband to come forth from the land of the dead and extract his vengeance, then yeah makes sense in this instance.

Case by case.

Posts: 13866
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 7:00 am

Post by serleran »

Basically, it takes being extraplanar or "created" by a spell with the word "summon" or "call" in its name -- gate is the exception there, but pretty much common sense is needed. If you want vampires to be hedged, then they are -- I would not, but that is irrelevant.
If it matters, leave a message at the beep.
Serl's Corner

Lore Drake
Posts: 1523
Joined: Wed May 03, 2006 7:00 am

Post by Maliki »

IMC it would not work against undead.
Never throw rocks at a man with a Vorpal Sword!

User avatar
Hlobane Orc
Posts: 160
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2008 7:00 am

Post by Grey »

Have to agree with DD and the above example - case by case (and tha ability to have this sort of C descision is why I like C&C!)

Posts: 20660
Joined: Mon May 01, 2006 7:00 am
Location: Arizona and St Louis

Post by Treebore »

Yeah, if a spell or ability that allows for a creature to be forcefully "summoned" from elsewhere (IE teleported or plane travelled from X to Y) then they are hedged out. If they were created in some other way then they are not blocked.

Gate is more like a doorway, so a spell like that would not count as "summoned or conjured", since the creature is coming of its own free will.
The Ruby Lord, Earl of the Society

Next Con I am attending:

My House Rules: ... llordgames
Since its 20,000 I suggest "Captain Nemo" as his title. Beyond the obvious connection, he is one who sails on his own terms and ignores those he doesn't agree with...confident in his journey and goals.
Sounds obvious to me! -Gm Michael

Grand Knight Commander of the Society.

Post Reply