Oh look, it's the 80's again!! Grab your parachute pants!!

Inkpot · Post by **Inkpot** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 12:59 pm

*sighs*
http://www.courttv.com/trials/flemons/1 ... .html?pg=0

Ink
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Omote · Post by **Omote** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 1:34 pm

That story already being 2+ years old, is of little consequence to the D&D community. The artical or lawyer was merely trying to paint the killer in a specific way by calling him a D&D player. Crap reporting, crap if used as an excuse.

.........................................Omote

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Tadhg · Post by **Tadhg** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 1:37 pm

Hmm, well sad to be sure. The real story here is that there are people running around everyday like that guy. Disturbed, deranged and otherwise mentally challenged, ready to explode at any time. As a society we need to find a better way to identify and help (or lockup) people like this.

Yeah and I know, it doesn't help when some ass picks on or abuses someone who is mentally challenged, especially one of our D&D brethen.
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Inkpot · Post by **Inkpot** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 3:05 pm

I didn't see that it was already two years old....but I was just amazed that this sort of sheep-brained, witch-burning lunacy over D&D (and RPG's in general) still exists twentysome years after already being proven to be BS.

The human psyche never ceases to amaze me....

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Omote · Post by **Omote** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 3:05 pm

*runs around*

................................................ mote

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Tadhg · Post by **Tadhg** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 3:25 pm

Inkpot wrote:
I didn't see that it was already two years old....but I was just amazed that this sort of sheep-brained, witch-burning lunacy over D&D (and RPG's in general) still exists twentysome years after already being proven to be BS.

The human psyche never ceases to amaze me....

Ink

I would say the human psyche of lawyers never ceases to amaze me and I come from a family of 'em!
The prosecutors will use any means of "portrayal"?, (not sure if that's the right word but) to get jurors (or judge) to believe a defendant is guilty based on some particular interest or hobby that they have.

However, a good defense attorney should be able to easily thwart this attempt to connect an RPG with criminal tendencies.

O'course the guy certainly seems guilty based on what I've read.
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Korgoth · Post by **Korgoth** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 3:47 pm

At one point a whim of my mom's cost me all my 1st ed AD&D books. It wasn't based on the hysteria, though - just, well... it was weird.

So I'm sensitive to the whole thing. But I can't help but think that a little controversy wouldn't be a horrible thing. It certainly doesn't seem to have hurt the sales of the Grand Theft Auto games.

Of course, there's always the possibility that renewed controversy would just lead to a bunch of chavs getting into the hobby.

OK, so nevermind.
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serleran · Post by **serleran** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 4:32 pm

At least it wasn't the cult of Floridian vampires that want to take over the world one bloodletting at a time.

gideon_thorne · Post by **gideon_thorne** » Thu Oct 26, 2006 4:40 pm

There's something very odd in the human psyche that often wishes to lay the cause of blame about a given problem on anything but the real source. It's sad really
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babbage · Post by **babbage** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 6:57 am

Well, in a world where 'Intelligent Design' can be claimed to be a provable theory, anything can happen.
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Omote · Post by **Omote** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 1:00 pm

What's the matter with parachute pants anyways! 8)

............................................Omote

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babbage · Post by **babbage** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:03 pm

No rip cord.
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Philotomy Jurament · Post by **Philotomy Jurament** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:06 pm

Parachute pants? I admit nothing.

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:28 pm

Ah, PJ. the ole' "They never exisited routine." We'll turn up a picture of you in 1991. *scours internet*
.....................................Omote

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serleran · Post by **serleran** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:35 pm

Parachute pants

Tadhg · Post by **Tadhg** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 2:46 pm

I loved my parachute pants. Along with black shoes and a black and white stripped shirt and a black blazer (collar up) we'd go to the "new wave" clubs and watch the videos!

My only regret was I couldn't get my hair quite like Simon LeBond and the others in Duran Duran!
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"Enjoy a 'world' where the fantastic is fact and magic really works!" ~ Gary Gygax

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Omote · Post by **Omote** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 3:32 pm

serleran wrote:
Parachute pants

HAHAHAHAHAHA... ROTFLMAO, there is actually a websitre dedicated to parachute pants... *pounds desk* That is some funny mutha *** **** mutha ***!
www.parachute-pants.com

......................................Omote

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Greg Ellis · Post by **Greg Ellis** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:16 pm

It's seem a bit odd that they mentioned D&D by name, yet failed to mention what brand of beer he purchased, or what type of cigar. Or where he buys his jeans, for that matter.

It would seem to me that the particular RPG he enjoyed would not be terribly relevant.

On the other hand, I'd be very interested to know what on earth he was smoking...

Inkpot · Post by **Inkpot** » Fri Oct 27, 2006 4:30 pm

And see, my problem with the whole thing is that the bastard DM probably didn't even give the co-worker a saving throw.....

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Robocoastie · Post by **Robocoastie** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 4:33 am

babbage wrote:
Well, in a world where 'Intelligent Design' can be claimed to be a provable theory, anything can happen.

ROFLMAO! good one, it made me blow my pepsi out my nose when i read that!

Post by **Breakdaddy** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 3:01 pm

Robocoastie wrote:
ROFLMAO! good one, it made me blow my pepsi out my nose when i read that!

Not me, little jabs like this at people's legitimate and harmless belief systems (whether I share them or not) piss me off. Its not funny or cute, its annoying and mean spirited.

Inkpot · Post by **Inkpot** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 3:10 pm

Breakdaddy wrote:
Not me, little jabs like this at people's legitimate and harmless belief systems (whether I share them or not) piss me off. Its not funny or cute, its annoying and mean spirited.

I gotta agree with Breakdaddy on this one...I was just too much of a wuss to say anything sooner.

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Post by **Breakdaddy** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 3:22 pm

I should probably mention that (in case anyone didnt know) I do not work for Troll Lord nor have I ever done so and my opinions are strictly my own. I live in Little Rock but am not affiliated with TLG, although I know them to be good folks.

Catweazle · Post by **Catweazle** » Sun Oct 29, 2006 6:13 pm

gideon_thorne wrote:
There's something very odd in the human psyche that often wishes to lay the cause of blame about a given problem on anything but the real source. It's sad really

Humans have always sought to abrogate responsibility. It's understandable, in a weird sort of way. It's easier for a start. You get told what to do, when to do it, you don't have to think hard about anything, and you're not responsible for any consequences because you're just doing as you're told.

In my experience, though, any time I have ever had to relinquish control to anybody else it has cost me, so I'll keep my own hands on my own reins and screw things up all by myself, thanks.

As for a defence attorney, it is their job to find some way to assist their client in avoiding conviction or to minimise the sentence. Lying, making up data or exaggerating the case is a perfectly acceptable way to do this, providing you don't get caught. Simialrly, it is a proecution attorney's job to get the defendant convicted and sentencved as severely as possible. Lying, making up data or exaggerating the case is a perfectly acceptable way to do this. The actual facts of the case are for everyone else to work out, which is what a judge and jury are for. They have to be impartial, since the defence and prosecution can't be.

It's a weird and nasty system, but it screw up less often than alternative ones.
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Orpheus · Post by **Orpheus** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 12:32 am

Well, exaggerating or "spinning" things in court may be accepted (yeah, I know that you said, "if you don't get caught", but c'mon), but "lying" or "making up data" are not accepted things. If any lawyer knowingly does these things they can be prosecuted and disbarred. Plus I'm sure that the lawyer mentioned D&D by name just because saying "roleplaying game" would mean nothing to the average viewer/reader. There is still a little bit of that 80's leftover stigma surrounding it in the collective psyche. Now we all know that it's the freaky, goth World of Darkness players who are the real nutbags!

Robocoastie · Post by **Robocoastie** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 12:38 am

Breakdaddy wrote:
Not me, little jabs like this at people's legitimate and harmless belief systems (whether I share them or not) piss me off. Its not funny or cute, its annoying and mean spirited.

the problem with that breakdaddy is that ID tried to claim itself as science and not a belief system - something they failed to prove which is why a Federal Judge (who is a christian btw) ruled against them. Specifically in his ruling Judge Jones said:

Quote:
"Pennsylvania, school board violated the U.S. Constitution by adding ID to the high school science curriculum. The judge also declared that ID meets none of the tests of a scientific theory and that it is simply an updated version of century-old creationist arguments against Darwin's theory of evolution. "ID is not science," Jones wrote. "We find that ID fails on three different levels. Moreover, ID cannot uncouple itself from its creationist, and thus religious, antecedents."

" source: "The Dover Descision" Science 6 January 2006:

Vol. 311. no. 5757, p. 34.

So you see, ID IS harmful, in the case of the Pennsylvania school they broke Federal law and tried to disguise religion in the form of science. That not only harms science and thus your children's education, but it is a LIE something the Christians claim to be a SIN.

Creationism itself when not lied about like ID I can have respect for a person believing. I don't agree and think they are practicing whats called "wishful thinking" or are ignorant with how science works but I can respect it. ID on the other hand I have zero respect for, will fight wherever it rears its ugly head at and anyone who calls themself a christian should as well for its misrepresentation of science which is the same as lieing.[/quote]

Philotomy Jurament · Post by **Philotomy Jurament** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 12:51 am

IMO, comments that are loaded with religious or political baggage and that are inserted into a dialogue out-of-the-blue, for no purpose other than to ridicule are, indeed, mean-spirited and cause nothing but problems. It simply shouldn't have a place in this thread, IMO. Poor taste.

Orpheus · Post by **Orpheus** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 12:59 am

Robocoastie wrote:
the problem with that breakdaddy is the ID'ers have yet to prove anything and its actually been found harmful which is why a Federal Judge who is also christian ruled against them and called them "liars, and manipulators". So you may want to check your facts next time before you try pulling the religion card.

Whaaaa? I think that Breakdaddy was implying that the "playing of the religion" card had been done when the comment was originally posted. As far as proof goes: no side of the where-we-come-from argument has proven anything. I know that this forum is for "open discussion," but let's be nice to one another here. If you want to be mean about anything...go post on the WoTC boards.

Robocoastie · Post by **Robocoastie** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 1:03 am

your only interpreting it as mean. Don't take it personally, look at the evidence.

Also the original purpose of it coming up was a way of pointing out that the whole satanic panic which resulted in everything from bashing RPG's to skateboard art was a direct result of fundamentalists who lacked critical thinking just like some do today who support ID.

So the pull of the religion card was by breakdaddy who tried to manipulate the comments to get points that he disagrees with struck down, plain and simple.

Philotomy Jurament · Post by **Philotomy Jurament** » Mon Oct 30, 2006 1:09 am

It's not that one side or the other is right; it's just poor taste to insert religion or politics into the discussion when it simply isn't necessary.