Troll Lord Games

This is one class that I have liked since the days of 1st Ed. AD&D. For me it's not always what the abilities of the class itself can do, but the class itself. I have always enjoyed the martial arts. But, I don't think that monks should just be limited in thought to the typical eastern martial arts/ philosophical ideal that many typify this class. Hand to hand combat comes in many different forms in different lands, and while different are no less effective if used properly. This goes from whether you stem from a boxer discipline to jiu-jitsu, or shorin-ryu karate to krav maga to kali to whatever.

The discipline of the various fighting styles is expressed in hand to hand as well as weapon combat. It is easy to see boxers, wrestlers (greco-roman, etc.) put within this certain class. I have gamed with many that when the mention of someone playing a monk is brought up, the first thing that is expressed is that this character is of little use. I beg to differ. It is how the character is played. I have seen many times when the same could be said of just about any other class within choice. If one plays a character well, thinking about what they are doing and remaining within the confines of the adventure, then one class can be truly as useful as another.

I've always loved monks, and yeah, I don't necessarily think of them in terms of shoalin kung fu masters. One thing I like about them is it gets you off the "stuff" treadmill, depending on how you interpret them. I like a monk with few possessions, just a need to wander the earth righting wrongs or wronging rights, or whatever their thing is. A flute, a bedroll, well, maybe I do subscribe to the shaolin kung fu thing, as interpreted by 1970s American TV.

That's not a bad thing though. It's fun to deal with the variety of types you could play.

Yeah the kung fu guy is the most obvious, but what about a wolverine-type pit fighter? or a story like the count of monte cristo where the protagonist learns boxing (savate, I suppose) instead of swordplay?

To really take a monk out of the stereotype of oriental and/or martial artist, have him played by Tony Shalhoub.

Well, I always was annoyed with a monk. It wasn't the class itself, it was the DM that made it automatically a "far east" class back when I gamed. I hated that I was forced to play a character from Tibet or China in a European setting

However, I like the idea of it if the class is expanded to be cover other societies. That is why I love the Pankrationist class from the last Crusader.

I like to mix monk with another class, dropping some abilities to pick up others, as I find the notion of an unarmed fighter in a world populated by things that suck your life if you touch them and where even a peasant can afford a sword to be rather... not the smartest "profession." But, I do keep them and use them, though in general, only in ancient places or those where arena fighting is available.

serleran wrote:and where even a peasant can afford a sword to be rather... not the smartest "profession."

It's not a matter a affording one. It is a matter of whether or not the peasant is permitted to have one. The latter is more important to the development of a monk type class...

I like my monks in the style of the Hercules TV series more than the Kung Fu TV series.

I like the monk class, I usually imagined them with an asian theme, but, it is easily adaptable to tough cloistered religious type or traveling Father Tuck type dude (or dudette for that matter). I'm looking forward to see how the Monk Class will compare to whatever (if any) equivilant that is portrayed in the upcoming Oriental Adventures type book that the Trolls are planning.

Arduin wrote:

serleran wrote:and where even a peasant can afford a sword to be rather... not the smartest "profession."

It's not a matter a affording one. It is a matter of whether or not the peasant is permitted to have one. The latter is more important to the development of a monk type class...

Sure, and definitely more so for an oriental-based setting (or one that encourages the strange and unusual weapons), but that is not generally how I set up mine. I do have a few locations with "rules" about open display of weapons or armor but there are no monks there -- they're mostly wizards.

TheMetal1 wrote:I like the monk class... I'm looking forward to see how the Monk Class will compare to whatever (if any) equivilant that is portrayed in the upcoming Oriental Adventures type book that the Trolls are planning.

As the author of OA for C&C I can say with confidence the Monk will appear as follows:
a) the "Monk" will be the same. (because, this is where they're from, so why reinvent the wheel? really the only difference at this point (so there could be tweaks) is the weapon list.
B) the "Yamabushi" is basically the monk, but with Weapon and Armor abilities replacing the unarmed abilities, and some other differences (so if this was a 1e book, it would be a monk sub-class, you could say).

I say this without re-reading the text but that's the basic idea.

So I hope that's exciting and enticing!
Further tease, my plan so far is to list the classes thru level 15ish (15ish being 12 - 15 depending on how it all works out), but have levels whatever to 24 in a later chapter, so they go thru level 24 like in the CKG.

I try to remove any cultural flavor from monks in my games. I try to view them as "people in search of perfect mental, physical, and spiritual attunement." I think that's a broad enough statement to have them be, "culture-less" in my games.

Relaxo wrote:

TheMetal1 wrote:I like the monk class... I'm looking forward to see how the Monk Class will compare to whatever (if any) equivilant that is portrayed in the upcoming Oriental Adventures type book that the Trolls are planning.

As the author of OA for C&C I can say with confidence the Monk will appear as follows:
a) the "Monk" will be the same. (because, this is where they're from, so why reinvent the wheel? really the only difference at this point (so there could be tweaks) is the weapon list.
B) the "Yamabushi" is basically the monk, but with Weapon and Armor abilities replacing the unarmed abilities, and some other differences (so if this was a 1e book, it would be a monk sub-class, you could say).

I say this without re-reading the text but that's the basic idea.

So I hope that's exciting and enticing!
Further tease, my plan so far is to list the classes thru level 15ish (15ish being 12 - 15 depending on how it all works out), but have levels whatever to 24 in a later chapter, so they go thru level 24 like in the CKG.

Very cool. Of course I gotta ask a couple of follow up questions

1. What other classes will be covered?

2. What are your plans, if any, for Martial Arts options/styles?

3. Will it be set in Ahirde, Inaze, the Tainted Lands, Setting Netural, or a new setting?

I am so thrilled you're asking!
Out of order, I'll answer;

3) Depending on page length: setting neutral, but maybe with a sketch of a setting just to give a skeleton of context on which CK can hang some meat and skin (not sure this is the best metaphor, LOL)

2) still developing this, but NOT a straight translation from earlier works (that being 3e and 1e). Most likely it will use advantages, but maybe list two options for CK to work with. My plan is to be broad and adaptable, not overly granular and rules-lawyer-ish.

1) A few include: Samurai and Ronin, Ninja and Shinobi (a black-magic wielding ninja, where as ninja is more like ranger/assassin), priest types, Lo-Fan (Hun-inspired mounted type barbarian), Wu-Jen (with a Siege engine twist that I'm really excited about). A fighter type of course (not the fighter from PHB, though). Of course the Kensai also. This isn't a complete list.

The book will have races, classes, martial arts, monsters, magic... and more!
(Nice alliteration: too much Stan Lee in my formative years?)

Shinobi!



That was the first thing that came to mind when I saw that class! The class sound spot on, looking forward to hearing about the Wu-jen as well.

Relaxo wrote:The book will have races, classes, martial arts, monsters, magic... and more!

You can't just throw that out there and not give any more details....Races? Monsters? Magic? TELL US MORE!!!!!

I USED TO LOVE THAT GAME!!!!!!!!

Ok... Hengeyokai and Half-Oni are planned as PC races.

Lord Dynel wrote:I try to remove any cultural flavor from monks in my games. I try to view them as "people in search of perfect mental, physical, and spiritual attunement." I think that's a broad enough statement to have them be, "culture-less" in my games.

Well said, sir!

Wasn't it in the most recent issue of The Crusader that Piperdog addressed this with the Pankriatist? Maybe I'm wrong...been a while since I read it, and my mind still hasn't quite kicked into gear this morning.

Lord Dynel wrote:I try to remove any cultural flavor from monks in my games. I try to view them as "people in search of perfect mental, physical, and spiritual attunement." I think that's a broad enough statement to have them be, "culture-less" in my games.

Same here. My world has no "Asian" culture...

Oh yeah, that Pankriatist class was badd ass!