Digital Version of the Rules

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Jupp
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Digital Version of the Rules

Post by Jupp »

I am frantically looking for an online version of the rules where all of the 13 classes are included. Is there such a pdf file available for purchase anywhere? So far I have only seen the C&C Condensed PHB. But that one misses several classes as far as I can see. I own the hardcopy version of the PHB but my scanner is too crappy to create a decent digital scan of said class pages
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Jupp

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Re: Digital Version of the Rules

Post by gideon_thorne »

There isn't one as far as I know.
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Post by Jupp »

I feared such an answer Thank you anyway for the fast response.

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Post by Philotomy Jurament »

You might take a look at Traveller's "Character Creation Cheat Sheet." Download it from here:
http://www.geocities.com/cnctraveller/cnc3.html

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Post by Birthright »

Jupp, check you PM.

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Post by moriarty777 »

Jupp,

I feel your pain. I've bought two copies of the book... and I've also picked up the Condensed PDF version.

I'm frequently on the go... and I would love the convenience of a complete PDF version myself.

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Post by Rath »

moriarty777 wrote:
Jupp,

I feel your pain. I've bought two copies of the book... and I've also picked up the Condensed PDF version.

I'm frequently on the go... and I would love the convenience of a complete PDF version myself.

Moriarty the Red

With the new 3rd print of the PHB almost here, I think it would be a good move for the trolls to make a .pdf of the 2nd printing of the PHB available for purchase. I know I'd like to own a .pdf of the book as well.

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Post by Joe Mac »

Funny -- I just came here to post the same question, and found Jupp's thread.

I'd love to buy a PDF of the full PHB, so I could copy and paste sections from the PDF to fiddle with for my house rules, and have the results neat and clean -- without having to type in all the text I'm leaving as-is...

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Post by Omote »

If TLG is going to release a .pdf version of the PHB, I'd hope they'd wait for the corrected 3rd printing of the rules before doing so. It would behoove TLG to release the best version of the product IMHO.

But for a .pdf version of the book, *shrugs* eh, no biggie.

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Post by moriarty777 »

Omote wrote:
If TLG is going to release a .pdf version of the PHB, I'd hope they'd wait for the corrected 3rd printing of the rules before doing so. It would behoove TLG to release the best version of the product IMHO.

But for a .pdf version of the book, *shrugs* eh, no biggie.

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I find it a bit odd that they chose to make available a full and complete version of the M&T in PDF format but not the PHB. They could have easily adopted to release a 'condensed' version of that book as well but didn't.

For me it's a convenience thing... I know many people who wouldn't care one way or the other and those who do.

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Post by Jupp »

Philotomy Jurament wrote:
You might take a look at Traveller's "Character Creation Cheat Sheet." Download it from here:

--snip--

Thanks Philotomy, I already have that thing on my harddisk So far I have the whole cheat sheet, the character sheets, the spell list, the CK screen as well as a CK screen "player version" translated to German
( Praise to the people from cncplayer dot net and to Traveller for creating those fantastic documents! )

The reason I would like to have the detailed class pages available as PDF is because I would like to print it out and give it to the players so they always have a reference at hand for their chosen class.

P.s: If someone would like to have those translated documents just raise your hands. Though I think the amount of CKs and players that are from the German speaking parts of this world is rather small

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Post by magehammer »

I vote for a PDF version of the PHB. I know, however, it is more than likely a business decision not to. I understand.

I just want to chime in and say, though, I own 1st printing, 2nd printing, and will own the 3rd printing, and I would still pay for a PDF.

Speaking of PDFs, when is Deeper Darkness going to be available at RPGNOw?
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Post by Emryys »

magehammer wrote:
Speaking of PDFs, when is Deeper Darkness going to be available at RPGNOw?

Yes, when? ...must have...
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Post by Wasgo »

So, any word on if this will ever happen yet?

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Post by gideon_thorne »

I still don't see it as very likely. At least not as an independent product.

The trouble with pdf's is that, even if you get one dishonest person, the file is out and all over the place and doing major damage to the company revenue.
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Post by SavageRobby »

I respect that that is the decision of the Troll Lords, even if I disagree with it (and have seen a number of publishers - RPG publishers, even - make a pretty fair living being PDF-only or having lines that are PDF-only).

I do with at some point they'd reconsider that. We were doing a C&C one shot on Friday, and it would have been really nice to be able to cut and paste the spell descriptions to make spell cards.

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Post by Wasgo »

gideon_thorne wrote:
I still don't see it as very likely. At least not as an independent product.

The trouble with pdf's is that, even if you get one dishonest person, the file is out and all over the place and doing major damage to the company revenue.

The thing is, if I recall correctly, the file is already out there. With scanners, OCR and people with way too much time and too few ethical concerns, even if you don't make it a PDF, someone else will. In this case, I think someone already did. The only issue now, for people that are aware of it, is that there is no legal viable alternative to have it as a PDF.

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Post by serleran »

The way I look at it is like this: if the Trolls can make money on it, they should do it. If they feel it impairs their ability to do what they want or its a bad business move, then don't. I can't say whether a pdf is viable because I don't buy them, don't use them, and have no practical purpose for one... so I'm inherently "anti-pdf" in a sense, but not anti-profit.

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Post by gideon_thorne »

Wasgo wrote:
The thing is, if I recall correctly, the file is already out there. With scanners, OCR and people with way too much time and too few ethical concerns, even if you don't make it a PDF, someone else will. In this case, I think someone already did. The only issue now, for people that are aware of it, is that there is no legal viable alternative to have it as a PDF.

And this, is precisely why PDF is not the way to go. It just takes one dishonest person...
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Post by Treebore »

This does prove that there is a market (of at least one) who may be interested in a "spell card" product for C&C.
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Post by DangerDwarf »

Treebore wrote:
This does prove that there is a market (of at least one) who may be interested in a "spell card" product for C&C.

Just not of the collectible variety please.

Dammit! Another Identify Card! Throw it in the pile....

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Post by serleran »

No, its perfect! What better way to limit the spell selection of your players than by making certain spell cards rare?! Hah! Want fireball? That'll be three hundred dollars, please. You want the components, too? Oh, I'm sorry but the black bat guano is an ultra-rare foil... that'll be $1k. YES! YES! I'm doing it.

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Post by SavageRobby »

gideon_thorne wrote:
And this, is precisely why PDF is not the way to go. It just takes one dishonest person...

This is where I disagree with you. The reality is there are going to be pirates no matter what, and there are people that will not pay for your product, period. And so, even while the Troll Lords didn't produce and sell a PDF, they've already got a pirated version out there. If there is already a pirated version out there, why not attempt to generate some revenue from releasing it yourself?

Now, Mr. Law-abiding-customer - like me - wants to be able to cut and paste from the rules to make his own equipment list, spell cards, alternate class versions, whatever. Despite having legally purchased the PHB (heck, I bought 3 of them, for extra copies at the table), if I want a PDF of the PHB I can't buy it legally. Instead, I either go without or need to go down a legally and ethically cloudy area to get one.

A number of folks, me included, would happily pay for a PDF in addition to the hard copies (I do it often with Savage Worlds stuff, not to mention buying a number of their PDF-only products, like the Toolkits). Yet what I'm told is that "No, you can't. We're not producing them for sale because people might pirate them. Oh, and they already have, so if you want a PDF go get the pirated version." Huh?

People steal candy bars. It doesn't mean convenience stores stop selling them. People steal cars. It doesn't mean that car companies stop making them or insurance companies stop insuring them.

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Post by SavageRobby »

Treebore wrote:
This does prove that there is a market (of at least one) who may be interested in a "spell card" product for C&C.

I don't like those so much, because its harder to change spell effects, durations, etc. You also can't personalize them for the player/character. I'd rather be able to fashion my own.

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Post by Wasgo »

SavageRobby wrote:
This is where I disagree with you. The reality is there are going to be pirates no matter what, and there are people that will not pay for your product, period. And so, even while the Troll Lords didn't produce and sell a PDF, they've already got a pirated version out there. If there is already a pirated version out there, why not attempt to generate some revenue from releasing it yourself?

This is what I don't get either. The pirated version of the PDF is already out. I'm not sure how having a legal version of the PDF could increase piracy at this point.

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Post by magehammer »

As a consumer, I would buy a PDF of the Player's Handbook, and I would never download the illegal version or share my PDF with my fellow gamers (they all have their own books anyway, just not PDF). I have been asking for one since I started playing.

As a person of a certain age with too much life experience, I respect the Trolls' stance on the issue; it's their company.

As far as the theft controversy, I don't run my own company, so I don't know enough to sound off credibly on it.

As a gamer, I would love to have a PDF of the PH.

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Post by Treebore »

For the record, I would buy a PDF as well. Eventually. Budget permitting.
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Post by moriarty777 »

SavageRobby wrote:
And so, even while the Troll Lords didn't produce and sell a PDF, they've already got a pirated version out there. If there is already a pirated version out there, why not attempt to generate some revenue from releasing it yourself?

I'm sure there is and it's only a matter of knowing where to look... However, even if it weren't true (hypothetically)... it would only be a matter of time before there was. The more popular the game becomes, the more that something like this will happen. All it takes is a bit of free time, a scanner, and if you really want to get fancy... proper OCR software to render the text search-able and select-able in convenient PDF format. This part isn't too hard of a stretch to imagine either... If they don't mind pirating the text, I'm sure they wouldn't be above using pirated software for this task either.

Once a PDF edition is made available (whether it be official or unofficial channels)... it would most likely spread like wildfire and many people who wouldn't spend the money would end up tracking it down.

However, I'm sure that TLG's decision to *not* do a full PDF version is also hampering the distribution of it illegally. In this case, there will still come a point where this policy is rendered irrelevant.

On the other hand... TLG is a small enough company that I'm sure every single copy of the PHB sold may really count for something. There may be other issues (such as distribution of the PDF) that we're not aware of. For all we know the full M&T PDF may have been to better test those waters. I don't really know.

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Post by Rhuvein »

So, is this pirated version on PDF, a high quality scan? Just curious.
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Post by Wasgo »

Rhuvein wrote:
So, is this pirated version on PDF, a high quality scan? Just curious.

I don't think it's appropriate to comment on that. For all intents and purposes, it shouldn't even exist.

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