d20 Call of Cthulhu and D&D 3.0

[rabindranath72]

A question to the moderators:

Can this topic be discussed here? Before I go on, due to a recent bad experience on DF, I would like to know if there is some ban of some topics.

Thanks,

Antonio

[bighara]

Seriously. I thought that whole situation over there was wacko. BTW, rabindranath, you could also try over at http://www.yog-sothoth.com/ they even have a d20 Cthulhu forum.

[rabindranath72]

bighara wrote:
Seriously. I thought that whole situation over there was wacko. BTW, rabindranath, you could also try over at http://www.yog-sothoth.com/ they even have a d20 Cthulhu forum.

I still cannot believe how people can become needlessly rabid. Really. DF is creating a really bad reputation due to these accidents.
Thanks for the pointer, I know that site, but there is very few activity there. I found much more interest at DF, despite it being (nominally) populated by people who only plays OOP games. You guys have contributed with some really good ideas. Thanks again.

[DangerDwarf]

rabindranath72 wrote:
I would like to know if there is some ban of some topics.

Just speaking as a frequent poster.

I'd prefer if people steered away from topics representing gnomes in anything more than a menial, puntable role.

On a serious note though, I doubt and would seriously hope such a topic as you mention wouldn't be nixed.

[rabindranath72]

DangerDwarf wrote:
Just speaking as a frequent poster.

I'd prefer if people steered away from topics representing gnomes in anything more than a menial, puntable role.

On a serious note though, I doubt and would seriously hope such a topic as you mention wouldn't be nixed.

In this setting gnomes would only be used as food for Shoggoth
I hope to get a positive word from one of the mods.

[bighara]

rabindranath72 wrote:
I still cannot believe how people can become needlessly rabid. Really. DF is creating a really bad reputation due to these accidents.
Thanks for the pointer, I know that site, but there is very few activity there. I found much more interest at DF, despite it being (nominally) populated by people who only plays OOP games. You guys have contributed with some really good ideas. Thanks again.

Thing is, CoC d20 is OOP. Has been for a while.
I was surprised to see that the book is also somewhat collectible/hard-to-find. I have 2 copies, so I feel lucky. If I ever run a game, I have a GM copy and one for the players to share. I liked your ideas a lot Antonio, I'd be tempted to run such a game myself if I had a group with enough interest. As it is, most of my CoC-ing is one-shot/short run adventures, not long-term games.

[rabindranath72]

bighara wrote:
Thing is, CoC d20 is OOP. Has been for a while.
I was surprised to see that the book is also somewhat collectible/hard-to-find. I have 2 copies, so I feel lucky. If I ever run a game, I have a GM copy and one for the players to share. I liked your ideas a lot Antonio, I'd be tempted to run such a game myself if I had a group with enough interest. As it is, most of my CoC-ing is one-shot/short run adventures, not long-term games.

Yes, but there is the "magic prefix" d20 which makes some people foam at the mouth
I started running a Cthulhu Dark Ages campaign "converted" to d20 Call of Cthulhu, and it went very well. Now I wanted to do the same within a more "fantasy" framework. We were having a really nice brainstorm there

[Omote]

My advice is if, we as a community, are going to have a discussion on d20 Call of Cthulhu here, keep the discussion civil and avoid topics that usually produce flame wars or overt BASHING of the d20 system.

This is a general forum for discussion, but when a thread turns icky in any way expect TLG mods to take care of matters.

Now back on subject...

Call of Cthulhu d20 is a pretty neat product.

...........................................Omote

FPQ
_________________
> Omote's Advanced C&C stuff <
Duke Omote Landwehr, Holy Order of the FPQ ~ Prince of the Castles & Crusades Society

[serleran]

Perhaps the actual discussion can take place where it best fits... either the Rules section, or another location. There is, also, that "collaborative design" place....

[rabindranath72]

serleran wrote:
Perhaps the actual discussion can take place where it best fits... either the Rules section, or another location. There is, also, that "collaborative design" place....

It would be nice, but not being directly related to C&C, I supposed this would be the least intrusive place. In any case, any place is good for me, as long as good idea keep flowing.

[gideon_thorne]

rabindranath72 wrote:
A question to the moderators:

Can this topic be discussed here? Before I go on, due to a recent bad experience on DF, I would like to know if there is some ban of some topics.

Thanks,

Antonio

TLG's been, and partly still is for the nonce, a d20/OGL company so ... knock yourself out. ^_^

Sure, it would be nice to keep the discussion focused around the systems TLG supports, but that will happen in this sort of topic anyhow. There's no need to force the issue.

Personally, I find such distinctions irrelevant. I like a game, or I don't. If I don't care for a given system and it's premise, I don't talk about it. Saves a lot of fuss and bother.
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Peter Bradley

[rabindranath72]

gideon_thorne wrote:
Personally, I find such distinctions irrelevant. I like a game, or I don't. If I don't care for a given system and it's premise, I don't talk about it. Saves a lot of fuss and bother.

From now on, you are my personal hero. Why people does not show this degree of intelligence more often?

[Orpheus]

I hadn't been over to the DF forums in a while, and I mainly use the site for the cool resources. I did decide to have a little look and see what the whole deal was regarding your thread Antonio, and wow! I still think that whole TETSBN crap gets a little out of hand over there. Are any of those guys married or have careers that act like that? Actually, the thread got me interested in checking out d20 CoC.

[Traveller]

So another person now sees why I refuse to have anything to do with Dragonsfoot.

Seriously though, unless you mention the game that shall not be named around here (and I'm NOT referring to d20 Fantasy), pretty much anything goes, with the caveat that I'm not an administrator and the decisions of the Trolls as to what can be discussed here are final.
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My small homage to E.G.G.

[Orpheus]

Traveller wrote:
unless you mention the game that shall not be named around here (and I'm NOT referring to d20 Fantasy)

Oh that OSTRICH thing?

[Tadhg]

Orpheus wrote:
Oh that OSTRICH thing?

Hey man, that won't fly around here!
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"Enjoy a 'world' where the fantastic is fact and magic really works!" ~ Gary Gygax

"By the pricking of my thumbs, Something wicked this way comes:" - Macbeth

[rabindranath72]

Orpheus wrote:
I hadn't been over to the DF forums in a while, and I mainly use the site for the cool resources. I did decide to have a little look and see what the whole deal was regarding your thread Antonio, and wow! I still think that whole TETSBN crap gets a little out of hand over there. Are any of those guys married or have careers that act like that? Actually, the thread got me interested in checking out d20 CoC.

It is really incredible. And it is incredible that trollish behaviour is condoned as long as it comes from "old schoolers". Also, many people there seem to act like bots: they do not seem to look at discussions in context, but only do some sort of "string matching": if the 3.x word is found (or something that resembles or has ties to it), then it is enough to lock the thread (as long as it does not come from a "respected old schooler"). And I do not want to even discuss the use of the word "TETSNBN". Depressing at best.

[rabindranath72]

Well, since I got the OK from the Troll Powers, here it is what I wanted to do.

Practically, "port over" (or use) d20 Call of Cthulhu as the basis for a "gritty" fantasy game. The scope and feel of the campaign would be more or less like described in the D&D-related appendix of said book, but I would reduce the impact of D&D magic (or remove it completely) and only allow the spells described in d20 CoC. All classes could cast spells according to the d20 CoC rules, but spellcasters would be able to cast a limited number of spells according to the usual d20 rules (i.e. without paying the usual costs associated with d20 CoC magic use). In essence, spells would be considered more like "rituals" when used by other classes (or by spellcasters, when the spell would be of an higher level than allowed).

Furthermore, I would avoid the usual D&D classes in favor of NPC classes (adept, aristocrat, warrior, expert, commoner). Actually, d20 CoC does not have classes, rather it is based on "skills collections" to define classes. While this works marvels for a modern game, I feel that a fantasy game should have some archetypes; hence the idea of using the NPC classes.

Demihumans might be allowed (still not sure); it would depend if the campaign was to feel more like "Warhammer" or "Hyborian Age".

So, what other ideas/suggestions do you guys have? Please note I am completely open to use C&C side by side with d20 CoC. I referred to the SRD NPC classes since they are the ones most readily available, but I guess something similar might be "concocted" also for C&C (as I and serleran were discussing over at DF).

Thanks,

Antonio

[rabindranath72]

A most excellent guy over at DF, Geoffrey, took the time to type and sort the d20 CoC spells according to D&D class and levels (a huge work, rewarded with a thread lock...):

Quote:
I've arranged all the d20 CoC spells according to the list on pp. 286-287, and I've added the five D&D spells (the spells listed in parentheses) suggested on p. 284. I think the lists for clerics and magic-users in particular are very good.

CLERIC SPELLS

0-level

Detect Magic

1st level

Cause Fear

(Deathwatch)

Detect Life

(Doom)

Magic Weapon

Raise Night Fog

2nd level

Augury

Consume Likeness

Darkness

(Death Knell)

Find Gate

Frozen Tracks

Identify Spirit

3rd level

Chant of Thoth

Curse of the Stone

Blind/Deafen

Eyes of the Zombie

Fist of Yog-Sothoth

Grasp of Cthulhu

Healing Touch

Hide from the Eye

Invisibility Purge

Locate Object

Obscuring Mist

Shriveling

Speak with Dead

Unmask Demon

4th level

Animal Form

Black Binding

Bring Pestilence

Cast out Devil

Dismissal

Divination

Power Drain

Seal of Isis

Snare Dreamer

Voice of Ra

Voorish Sign

5th level

Curse of Chaugnar Faugn

Insect Plague

Wave of Oblivion

6th level

Bind Enemy

Create Bad-Corpse Dust

Word of Recall

7th level

Control Weather

Dread Curse of Azathoth

8th level

Elder Sign

Eye of Light and Darkness

9th level

Call Deity

Dismiss Deity

DRUID SPELLS

0-level

Detect Life

Detect Magic

3rd level

Curse of the Stone

Death by Flames

Dominate Animal

4th level

Bind Loup-Garou (Cage of Kind)

Bring Pestilence

Hands of Colubra

Healing Touch

Seal of Isis

5th level

Insect Plague

7th level

Control Weather

8th level

Word of Recall

MAGIC-USER SPELLS

0-level

Detect Magic

(Ghost Sound)

(Mage Hand)

Message

1st level

Cause Fear

Detect Life

Hypnotism

Magic Weapon

Raise Night Fog

Skin of Sedefkar

True Strike

Warding the Eye

2nd level

Blind/Deafen

Circle of Nausea

Cloak of Fire

Consume Likeness

Curse of the Putrid Husk

Darkness

Death by Flames

Eibons Wheel of Mist

Evil Eye

Find Gate

Levitate

Locate Object

Obscuring Mist

Pose Mundane

Red Sign of Shudde Mell

Sekhmenkenheps Words

View Gate

Ward against Psychics

3rd level

Animal Form

Candle Communication

Cast out Shan

Cloud Memory

Clutch of Nyogtha

Curse of the Stone

Deflect Harm

Eyes of the Zombie

Flesh Ward

Hands of Colubra

Identify Spirit

Suggestion

4th level

Banishment of Yde Etad

Black Binding

Body Warping of Gorgoroth

Contact Human

Create Scrying Window

Grasp of Cthulhu

Imprison Mind

Locate Creature

Mindblast

Mirror of Tarkhun Atep

Power Drain

Seal of Isis

Wrack

5th level

Become Spectral Hunter

Breath of the Deep

Curse of the Rat-Thing

Dismissal

Dominate Person

Magic Jar

Mind Transfer

Nightmare

Return to Rest

Soul Trap

Unspeakable Oath

Wither Limb

6th level

Bind Soul

Contact Creature (level varies depending on monster)

Create Barrier of Naach-Tith

Dread Curse of Azathoth

Spectral Razor

7th level

Control Weather

Create Self-Ward

Dark Resurrection

Steal Life

Summon/Bind Creature

Wandering Soul

8th level

Create Gate

Elder Sign

Eye of Light and Darkness

Look to the Future

9th level

Contact Deity

Create Time Gate

Dismiss Deity

BARD SPELLS

0-level

Detect Magic

(Ghost Sound)

(Mage Hand)

Message

1st level

Cause Fear

Hypnotism

Obscuring Mist

2nd level

Blind/Deafen

Darkness

Locate Object

Sekhmenkenheps Words

Suggestion

3rd level

Eibons Wheel of Mist

Pipes of Madness

Sirens Song

4th level

Deflect Harm

Dominate Person

Locate Creature

Soul Singing

5th level

Nightmare

Song of Hastur

ASSASSIN SPELLS

1st level

(Ghost Sound)

True Strike

2nd level

Darkness

4th level

Locate Creature

BLACKGUARD SPELLS

1st level

Cause Fear

(Doom)

Magic Weapon

2nd level

Darkness

(Death Knell)

PALADIN SPELLS

1st level

Magic Weapon

INAPPROPRIATE SPELLS

Enchant Item

Power of Nyambe

This gives a nice picture of what spellcasters are able to do, in case one wanted to use the default classes.

I would only use the level information for my campaign idea (including the INAPPROPRIATE SPELLS).

[mordrene]

I have been trying to start a d20 modern game but using the coc d20 rules. I wouldnt even uses classes just professions. set up skill sets for warriors, adepts, experts, etc..

on a related note i also have been tinkering with incorperating chasiom coc weapon skills into the d20 coc skills. take base to hit out and use it as a skill. that way the professions will work better. the d20 coc gives 8 + int mod for skill points per level but that would make the proffessions more important.

[Orpheus]

Rhuvein wrote:
Hey man, that won't fly around here!

Classic.

[Dyne]

3.x was good until they started cranking out splatbooks, new editions, and random rules changes. Some of the supplements were good, but honestly I had the most fun when all I had were the 3.0 core rulebooks.

Tried out D20 Modern, didn't like the talents/wealth systems, among other things. Professions were an interesting touch, though.

I have mixed feelings about Star Wars D20. The Revised Core Rulebook version had difficulties regarding Jedi/The Force, as well as certain things involving equipment and combat. Saga Edition was slightly better in those areas, but it screwed up practically everything else instead. I prefer sortof a hybrid/homebrew system, but if I had to choose, I would pick the RCR version.

I've never played D20 Call of Cthulu, but I've heard good things about it. I've also heard Monte Cook was coming out with a D20 version of World of Darkness (or maybe it's already out). But anyway, those are my opinions on the world of D20; basically, that system is the reason I went back to video games.

[g026r]

According to the info on RPGnet (I'd link to it, but I don't have the minimum required number of posts yet ), it was supposed to have been released at GenCon. Haven't seen any reviews of it anywhere yet, but I haven't been looking too hard. The WoD setting never really was my thing.

I've been thinking of going back and taking another look at d20 CoC as of late. I sold my copy on eBay shortly after I acquired it (for not that much -- I'm as surprised as others that it's become something of a collector's item since) as I wasn't terribly impressed at the time, but some of the ideas in the thread over at DF have given me pause to think of other ways in which the rules could have been used.

I know the SO brought a copy with her when she moved in, so I may have to dig it out and take another look. Regardless, I look forward to the new ideas with relish.

[ConnallMac]

I haven't posted here in ages, but that craziness over the recent d20CofC thread over at DF has made me want to step away from there for a while. Why do they want to reinforce these artificial divisions between gamers? Nothing like further fragmenting an already shrinking hobby! I would think they would want to invite in any players of 3.x D&D and convert them to various old school style games. But apparently they want to kill their treasured editions as quickly as possible.....

[Traveller]

A message for Dragonsfoot, since I know they police their members by what those members say on other sites.

A message for the Bunker Buddies, the terrorists of the role-playing world.

A message for anyone else who just doesn't get it.

Go ahead and kill the sacred cows while claiming to save them.

Go ahead and claim that you're legal, when everyone knows otherwise.

Go ahead and try to convert everyone to the "one true way".

Go ahead and shove your attitude straight up your candy ass.

Men, women, and small furry creatures from Alpha Centauri, it's simply a game. Any religious overtones, illegal acts, or killing of sacred cows are performed by a tiny minority of people with nothing better to do than to act as shepherds for us "lost sheep", saving us from what they perceive to be "wrong" not realizing that in trying to do so they destroy the very thing they attempt to save.
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[rabindranath72]

Eh, sad indeed that people well over their thirties behave like children who enjoy themselves spoiling the fun of other children.

Guys, I know this kind of arguments can get off hand, may I ask you to stay focused on the topic? I would avoid this thread getting closed, too

[rabindranath72]

A guy over at DF (order99) suggested the following basic professional templates for a C&C-d20CoC fantasy campaign, which mimic the NPC classes in the SRD, which I originally thought about using. Note that "master level" is a campaign-specific level. In my case, I would assume something around 5th-7th level.

Quote:
Warrior

HD-D8 until Master Lvl, +2 HP beyond.

Armor/Weapons-all.

Defense Option Greater(Column B of CoC table)

Skills-3

Abilities-Weapon Specialisation(Lvl 1) an extra Skill(Lvl 3) Extra Attack(Master Lvl 5)

Adept

HD-D6 until Master, +1 HP beyond.

Armor/Weapons-Club, Dagger, Dart, Staff, Shortsword, Leather Coat.

Defense Option Lesser(Column A)

Skills-4

Abilities-Foul Magics(Lvl 1) an extra Skill(Lvl 3) Decipher Script(Master)

Expert

HD-6 until Master, +1 beyond.

Armor/Weapons-as Bard.

Defense Option Lesser

Skills-8

Abilities-Skill Focus(+3 to any one skill, once-Lvl 1) Extra Skill(Lvl 3) Legend Lore(Master)

Aristocrat

HD D6 until Master, +2 afterwards

Defense Option: Lesser

BTH-as Cleric

Weapons and Armor-as Bard

Skills-4

Abilities-Instruction(as Bardic Exalt, Lvl 1) Extra Skill(Lvl 3) Weapon Specialisation(as Fighter at Lvl 1, but at Master Lvl)

These would qualify as Skills:

Ranger-Conceal, Delay/Neutralize Poison, Scale, Move Silently, Traps, Survival, Track.

Rogue-Cant, Pick Pockets, Climb, Hide, Move Silently, Traps, Open Lock.

Case Target, the other Rogue Abilities, Poisons, Disguise.

And for perhaps the cost of Two Skill slots:

Favored Enemy(Ranger)

Back Attack (Rogue)

Primal Fury(Barbarian)

Combat Sense(Barbarian)

Fast Movement(Monk, only as the 3rd Lvl Ability at 40')

Sharp Senses(Illusionist)

[ConnallMac]

rabindranath72 wrote:
Eh, sad indeed that people well over their thirties behave like children who enjoy themselves spoiling the fun of other children.

Guys, I know this kind of arguments can get off hand, may I ask you to stay focused on the topic? I would avoid this thread getting closed, too

Sorry, I just had to get that off my chest!

[rabindranath72]

ConnallMac wrote:
Sorry, I just had to get that off my chest!

No need to be sorry, you are right and I fully understand you. It is just that I would avoid the thread derailing

[ConnallMac]

rabindranath72 wrote:
No need to be sorry, you are right and I fully understand you. It is just that I would avoid the thread derailing

Fair enough. Carry on here!