NECROMANCER GAMES IS ALIVE!! Sort of....

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Wed May 05, 2010 7:43 pm

Absolutely. I certainly do not need to do it for myself. I convert it as I go too.
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froggie · Post by **froggie** » Thu May 06, 2010 7:34 pm

Hey guys--subscription should be up tomorrow. I get that it sounds like a bundle; but when you take into account that its 14 x 35-50 page modules....does it really? Thats like $8 / module.

Give the $2 starter chapter a toss and see if you think its a good product. Keep in mind that I do not skimp on maps at all (they cost a ton), and since we are not gonna print 1000 of these, POD is quite pricey. The sub will include all the pdfs + the hard cover at the end.

Keep me posted on thoughts.

Bill

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Thu May 06, 2010 8:37 pm

Just to keep the site link fresh:
www.talesofthefroggod.com

~O
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moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Thu May 06, 2010 10:08 pm

You know... I'm torn about this.

It sounds like a great series and the quality I'm sure will be fantastic and measure up to some of the best products that NG have come out with in the past. The City of Brass and the Wilderlands box sets both immediately come to mind. Now at $70 apiece, I thought they were pricey but I feel that one of these box sets had a better value than Goodman Games 'Castle Whiterock' set which had an original MSRP of $100. These two beautiful sets had a combined page count of roughly 875 pages and for $140 you had some fantastic material. Both boxes are jammed with material and then there are maps and stuff beyond the books.

In this case, this saga will see between a total of 400 and 700 pages once complete and, no mater which way you spin it, $125 is good sized chunk of change. I think the $170 option (if you don't take advantage of the subscription offer) is a bit ridiculous.

Or is it?

Is it just for one hardcover or will the series be divided among something like 2 or 3 books? I guess it depends on the final page count but I dislike books that surpass a 400 page count. The size of the tome is one of my concerns and a proper binding if a very large book is anticipated.

The release schedule seems great but I admit I'm worried at a heavy release schedule and would be concerned about a possibility of a stall on the project or an abrupt end.

As a Canadian, I also shudder at the notion of shipping this mammoth tome to me once it's complete since S/H is (naturally) not included. This could easily tack on an extra $20 to 30 to the overall cost of this project (and let's not forget those wonderful customs people) on something which is kind of pricey to begin with.

Just paying a ton of cash on a digital only copy seems kind of foolish to me too which means the only viable option is to take the plunge / risk or pass on it entirely. I'm also not a 'Pathfinder guy' which is another reason why I keep wondering about his project.

I'm I'm really on the fence on this one because it looks fantastic and Orcus is probably the number one bad-ass in my games. But cost and concerns really are holding me back.
M
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Frost · Post by **Frost** » Fri May 07, 2010 1:11 am

moriarty777 wrote:
The release schedule seems great but I admit I'm worried at a heavy release schedule and would be concerned about a possibility of a stall on the project or an abrupt end.

Keep in mind, from my understanding at least, the material has been written. It's a matter of layout and converting it to Pathfinder.

I'm not a Pathfinder guy myself, but it seems like the current d20 standard and simply enough to convert to the games I actually play (3.5 and C&C).
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Omote · Post by **Omote** » Fri May 07, 2010 2:23 am

The product has been written for some 4 years now, even through editing at Necromancer Games, and through some artwork/maps. Now, Greg Vaughn is tidying up the project and someone else is doing the Pathfinder conversion. New maps (and I presume artwork) is on the way.

I'm jazzed. I don't care for what version of D&D/like-D&D games it's for, just that it's coming out is good enough.

I can certainly see why the $125-$170 price tag would throw off some people. Especially if you are not familiar with Necromancer Games level of quality (see Rappan Athuk Reloaded, City of Brass, Wilderlands of High Sorcery), the price tag is frightening.

Based on what the author has said, the project when wrapped years ago was 500,000 words. That's A LOT of frickin' material.

Plus, with the linkage to other Necromancer Games products, whew, that is a BIG selling point for me.

~O
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moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Fri May 07, 2010 2:56 am

Frost wrote:
Keep in mind, from my understanding at least, the material has been written. It's a matter of layout and converting it to Pathfinder.

I'm not a Pathfinder guy myself, but it seems like the current d20 standard and simply enough to convert to the games I actually play (3.5 and C&C).

Oh... I'm not doubting about the written stuff but between layout... art... editing... converting... etc, it can still be a heck of a lot to get down within a month depending on how many people are working on it and stuff.

As for the Pathfinder angle... well... the more I looked through it, the less and less I saw a real need for it considering that some of the changes actually made the power scale a bit worse for everything I have seen and read. However as a conversion to Pathfinder, that might now be so bad.

M
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moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Fri May 07, 2010 3:08 am

Omote wrote:
I can certainly see why the $125-$170 price tag would throw off some people. Especially if you are not familiar with Necromancer Games level of quality (see Rappan Athuk Reloaded, City of Brass, Wilderlands of High Sorcery), the price tag is frightening.

Based on what the author has said, the project when wrapped years ago was 500,000 words. That's A LOT of frickin' material.

Plus, with the linkage to other Necromancer Games products, whew, that is a BIG selling point for me.

That's the thing -- I am familiar of the quality level but I can't help but think the price is a bit much. I was fortunate with some of my NG products, I actually didn't pay full price for those $70 box sets and I passed them over many times because of the price. That is not to say that these weren't worth it but I knew that, while I wanted to have them and would enjoy them, they wouldn't be getting the kind of use to warrant that sort of expenditure. Of course, now that I own them, I don't imagine I will EVER be parting with them.

For me, it comes down to this:

Would I be willing to spend $170 on a single POD gaming book? The answer is absolutely not.

Now, I have spent $125 on a book before. It was not a gaming book and it was a rarer collectible from a finite print run. This sounds to be $125 for a book that is still POD though it is signed and that is always nice. This is why I haven't dropped the idea yet and find myself 'on the fence'. I know that if I don't go for the subscription offer, I will not be getting the $170 deal and I refuse to spend about $100 on a PDF product (well ... collection).

I will give the $2 / first chapter a try though and probably make my decision then.

M
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Omote · Post by **Omote** » Fri May 07, 2010 2:15 pm

Again, the price tag for this project is outstandingly high. I'm not sure Frog God Games is even looking to market this project to the masses as it were. They are probably going to go for the hardcore NG fans, and if that works well, so be it. If it doesn't sell very well, perhaps they will lower to cost for the .pdfs. I just don't ever see Bill Webb going back on his work and selling the eventual hardcover book for the ole $70.00 price tag of the old days.

~O
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froggie · Post by **froggie** » Sat May 08, 2010 2:50 am

At dinner party now,so cannot answer all.$125 is because the print costs are huge on something I plan to sell 100 or so of. Maps are expensive, and I will not do cheap maps. I play 0E, but only a few of us do...hence PF, as 4E is an abberration to me, some folks like it, but its not for me.

Tree and Duke; happy to let you do a C&C conversion, heck,I'll post it up/lay it out as an appendix. Great idea; of course,for me,I just ignore stats and roll w/ 0e stuff anyway.

Tree and Duke have it right, this book is not for mass market; its for those folks who know and have been loyal for the last 10 years or so.

Will write more later; but suffice to say, this thing is epic, its written, and its awesome...does not matter which edition its in for use (well, except 4e). I won't sell others cheap later either...not fair to those folks who helped make it a reality. Same reason I did not reprint RARE after we got 2700 orders for 1000 books--the 1000 pre-orders took the risk, I was not gonna give latecomers the same deal as the folks who believed at the start.

I love the Necro faithful; I did this because I promised them I would. I may still have a trick (book) or two up my sleeve after we get this rolling as well.

ps--Tree--I need Alica's art again--my PC crapped the bed and I lost originals. Have her ping me!

serleran · Post by **serleran** » Sat May 08, 2010 3:10 am

You should do that book on the extraplanar princes of pain with Bowbe and Scott... that would kick so much NG ass.
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Pale Writer · Post by **Pale Writer** » Sat May 08, 2010 5:45 am

The N'Gathau?

And, just to defend the system I like: Plenty of us old-school gamers playin' Pathfinder, dagnabbit!

Pale Writer · Post by **Pale Writer** » Sat May 08, 2010 6:06 am

OK, Slumbering Tsar, Chapter 1: The Desolation final has been sent to Bill.

Hope ya like.

froggie · Post by **froggie** » Sat May 08, 2010 1:33 pm

I am happy to arrange special printing (you just pay cost if you subscribe, no more) to print this as 2-3 softcovers. I will look into DTRPG for what that would cost (maybe about the same as a hardcover Tome--I think maybe an extra $8 or so per book).

Keep in mind this will be a huge PITA if everyone does it, but I am willing to go out on a limb (like Kim Mohan....) and do this for folks.

Book (hardcover) likely weighing in around 600 pages or so.

As you guys all know (well those who know me) I will always try to work w/ you if I can.

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Sat May 08, 2010 6:59 pm

I'm thinking the real news is that this book is going to weigh in around 600 pages! That is... farking fantastic! If any player steps out of line, *whack* Omote gets 20-life.

~O
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Duke Omote Landwehr, Holy Order of the FPQ ~ Prince of the Castles & Crusades Society

froggie · Post by **froggie** » Sun May 09, 2010 5:59 pm

The $2 intro chapter will be up later today. The subscribers should all have the stuff already!

Give this shot!

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Wed May 12, 2010 3:32 am

Well, Omote, looks like we have us some work to do. Thank the RPG gods we are converting to C&C, rather than to PF.
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NECROMANCER GAMES IS ALIVE!! Sort of....

Hey all

lots of stuff

gonna regret this...but

non-subscriptions to Slumbering Tsar