Line of sight...

[Treebore]

I totally agree with line of sight, it can really help keep spell casters in line.

What bugs me is spells that ignore this basic rule.

For example, Detect evil/Chaos/Good. Because in effect it is a poor man's X-ray vision. It allows you to see through walls and doors, etc... Granted, you do not "see" the actual creature, but you do see that it is there, and if it is or is not in the alignment spectrum your detecting for. Plus, unless they are behind items thicker than the spell description specifically states is needed to block it, you cannot successfully hide from someone using this spell.

So personally I think this spell should not be allowed to bypass "line of sight". It should not, and never should have, been allowed to see through walls, etc... Or at least be required to be a higher level spell in order to see through things, maybe 4th level.

So does anyone have any variants on this? Do you like how it is a poor man's X-ray vision?

Do you think "line of sight" should be strictly adhered to like I do? Or do you think it is OK to allow line of sight to be ignored with certain spells?

[Kayolan]

My opinion, it shouldn't be a 0 level spell. Also, the duration is way too long. So perhaps making it a line of sight spell would fix it or maybe just up the level or significantly shorten the duration (which would still require a level raise I would think).

Take a look at Detect Undead...

[Rigon]

From a player's perspective: I like being able to see through walls.
From a CK's perspective: I would limit all detect spells to line of sight.

R-

[Omote]

Doesn't it say somewhere that 1 foot of wood, 1 inch of stone, or a thin sheet of lead prevents a spell from passing through it?

~O

[Treebore]

Doesn't it say somewhere that 1 foot of wood, 1 inch of stone, or a thin sheet of lead prevents a spell from passing through it?

~O

Yes it does say such a thing, but doors are not that thick (think it said 1 foot), walls are often not that thick ( think it said 3 feet), etc...

[Go0gleplex]

I've never allowed the detect spells to go through objects such as walls or doors. If a room full of columns however, I may allow the general presence of evil to be detected, but no set location.

[serleran]

I love that it can pierce through walls and doors, both as a player and Castle Keeper. It can be used to produce a sense of foreboding, and it does not provide any idea about the distance (except somewhere within the area of effect) which can wreck havoc when they cannot see it, but know something is there... is it invisible or in the walls? These types of spells can be great for setting up a horror environment.

[gideon_thorne]

Spells like this amount to a form of ESP. They aren't 'xray vision', they are an instinctive psychic sense of general danger or safety. Time, space, and physical objects are no barrier to such a sense. At least not in my opinion.

[Omote]

GT is all about the psychic emenations. Actually, that is kind of a cool way to look at it. Also... THEY COULD BE IN THE WALLS... like those rats. Nice.

~O

[Relaxo]

Defeating Line of Sight is the point of some spells, don't you think?
it is MAGIC after all.

[RAD Colin]

I love that it can pierce through walls and doors, both as a player and Castle Keeper. It can be used to produce a sense of foreboding, and it does not provide any idea about the distance (except somewhere within the area of effect) which can wreck havoc when they cannot see it, but know something is there... is it invisible or in the walls? These types of spells can be great for setting up a horror environment.

I'm with Serl on this; it may ruin absolute surprise, but in terms of building potential suspense, it's great.

Colin

[Sir Osis of Liver]

I love that it can pierce through walls and doors, both as a player and Castle Keeper. It can be used to produce a sense of foreboding, and it does not provide any idea about the distance (except somewhere within the area of effect) which can wreck havoc when they cannot see it, but know something is there... is it invisible or in the walls? These types of spells can be great for setting up a horror environment.

These make for great ways to create red herrings. A creative CK can come up with ways to make these spells far less like the x-ray vision that tree worries about, and closer to Peter's thoughts on the ESP.

[Go0gleplex]

If there is an evil so strong in the neighborhood, I don't require a detect evil. The aura the thing leaves behind by its mere presence for "x" duration is enough to be palatable to all entering into its lair. In some cases (a recent adventure written) the evil is so strong as to be not only detectable by mere rubes, but even become debilitating. Then again...I am a bit "odd".

[Sir Osis of Liver]

The other flip side of this is that, if a paladin is in the group, the bad guys can use those same detection spells to see him through solid walls as well. Makes it interesting when the monsters can't be surprised. As he increases in power, and the strength of his aura increases, he's going to be a walking billboard to anything that can detect good.

[Tadhg]

Tree knows my thoughts on this, as it came up in our game last night.

I think it's a simple spell that detects an aura. No X-ray vision. You can't see people/monsters . . only the presence of alignment. It's not like the more powerful "Know alignment" spell of AD&D which allows detection of multiple peeps and their alignment.

To me, this a basic logical clerical spell that I don't consider to be a "line of sight" spell at all.

I believe the basis of this spell is from "detect evil/good" in AD&D.