Troll Lord Games

Is anyone here using the 3rd edition "spontaneous casting" rule for clerics (allowing them to always be able to trade out a prepared spell for a healing spell of equal or lesser level).

If so, how does this affect C&C gameplay? Anything imbalancing? Does it work just fine. If I allow this as a "class feature" for my clerics, is there anything I am missing that will throw anything out of balance?

Thanks!

I don't allow spontaneous casting but I do allow spell swapping....LIke so

Reading a spell from your spellbook, or praying for a different spell. Characters may swap spells if they successfully make an ability check [INT/WIS] with CL being the level of the spell. Failure means they lose the spell for the day, success means it works. It takes 1 full turn to prepare this + the casting time of the new spell.

So there is a chance you lose the spell and it takes 1 turn. [But since the spell caster will always be dealing with a Prime attribute the odds are pretty good.]

-Mike

I've always allowed it; it lets the clerics actually flex some of those divine magic muscles.

Regarding balance, my advice is: don't worry about it. Classes in C&C are not designed to be "balanced" in the sense of everyone being able to contribute equally to all encounters.

It's allowed in the Sunday game I play in, since about the fifth session or so, and the world didn't come crashing in around us, and it's probably responsible for our party continuing to exist. If it works in 3.5, there isn't much reason to believe it won't work in C&C. If there was a reason, I don't think anyone here could be bothered to crunch the numbers (though it's happened before...)

It's kind of interesting, some people complain the the cleric is relegated to being the party doctor, and I don't know which way spontaneous healing spells twist that. On one hand, now you can prepare non-healing spells and be more effective on that front. On the other hand, now people will expect you to sacrifice those spells, whereas before you could say "Tough, I'm a buffer today."

I slightly prefer the dynamic where healing is scarce, but the players will almost certainly value the spontaneous casting of healing spells, and who can blame them. I don't think it's nearly as destructive to the game as "extended rests" and "second winds".

I didn't allow it in 3.x and I probably won't in C&C. Forces the person playing the Cleric to start thinking ahead rather than for the moment. Clerics need to think in the long term...

Swords & Wizardy got me thinking about this.

The way I plan to run it is, the Cleric still has to pray at the beginning (Like the Magic-User has to memorize) but the Cleric can use whatever spells he has on his list when casting. Still using the spells per day rule. The rub is because it is divine, his god might not grant the spell. It wouldn't take away that spell slot, for the day, the spell just doesn't work.

I might make an easy chart, based on the character level of percentage of spell failure.

Sir Ironside wrote:Swords & Wizardy got me thinking about this.

The way I plan to run it is, the Cleric still has to pray at the beginning (Like the Magic-User has to memorize) but the Cleric can use whatever spells he has on his list when casting. Still using the spells per day rule. The rub is because it is divine, his god might not grant the spell. It wouldn't take away that spell slot, for the day, the spell just doesn't work.

I might make an easy chart, based on the character level of percentage of spell failure.

I remember some early G.G. DM advice where the cleric's god might "grant" different spells than those asked for...

Arduin wrote:I didn't allow it in 3.x and I probably won't in C&C. Forces the person playing the Cleric to start thinking ahead rather than for the moment. Clerics need to think in the long term...

I find the benefits of not forcing the cleric to memorize healing spells, and letting them instead actually take some utility or offensive spells, helps make the class more fun and appealing to the generation of players I game with. Your mileage may vary, of course. If you a game more focused on resource management, then I can see your path being more appealing. My games tend to be much looser in that regard.

CKDad wrote: If you a game more focused on resource management, then I can see your path being more appealing. My games tend to be much looser in that regard.

No, just more focused on role playing the cleric as a divine representative rather than just another type of wizard/spell-caster...

It sort of depends. We've always allowed clerics to 'burn' a like-level spell for a healing one, especially in moments of dire necessity... it allowed players to pick more of a variety of spells (especially in early levels, where a cleric might only have a couple spell slots) and still made them have to think and plan when they burned them off (which spell do I lose to cast this?)

By the same token, needing to burn spell slots as heals was always more of an issue in 3.x with its more exhaustive spell lists from all the Spell Compendium and all the varied splat books. In BTB C&C, with its more modest list of clerical spells, that may not be such an issue

I've begun to think it might be worthwhile to base it on the sort of god/goddess the cleric follows, too. If the cleric followed a god of healing, fertility or growth, for instance, I would probably give the option to burn off filled like-level slots as healing spells as a granted power. I might not do that for a sun god or the like.

ArgoForg wrote: I've begun to think it might be worthwhile to base it on the sort of god/goddess the cleric follows, too. If the cleric followed a god of healing, fertility or growth, for instance, I would probably give the option to burn off filled like-level slots as healing spells as a granted power. I might not do that for a sun god or the like.

That's a good idea and adds depth/differentiation to the class. Different deities, different clerics.

Arduin wrote:

CKDad wrote: If you a game more focused on resource management, then I can see your path being more appealing. My games tend to be much looser in that regard.

No, just more focused on role playing the cleric as a divine representative rather than just another type of wizard/spell-caster...

And an argument can be made that such a warrior-priest that the class represents has a sufficient tie to their deities so as to be able to call upon them in dire need for aid.

Whichever way works best for the players & GM is good, IMHO.

I typically dont have clerics prepare spells. They may cast as needed. Since they are divine casters, i like the idea of asking their diety on the spot for the gift of whatever spell they need.