Winter Runes

[Troll Lord]

I really like this new logo -- and hope that Crusader Magazine (for which we await future issues Real Soon Now) takes this sort of logo. Right now, the Crusader's logo doesn't look like the word "crusader" and wouldn't grab the eye of a potential purchaser. Assuming we can get it into more hobby stores, comics shops, and Barnes & Noble.

(Hey, did I just hijack this thread??!)

We'll eventually get to that on teh Crusader. But I just pulled that from stores. The cost per unit wasn't hitting where it needed to be. It will be direct only.

Steve

[Troll Lord]

Quick question about the new 'Kickstarter' you've got going for the C&C Winter Runes book (the d20 version was one of my favorites in your old lineup):

The hardcover version of it, is this being done in-house or are you using the guys who did the PHB and M&T print runs? Is the final product (what we will see on store shelves) hardcover or softcover?

I know there was a lot of challenges for TLG when you did the initial batches of hardcovers (primarily the CKG) and I've read comments about 'durability' issues. Truth to tell, I didn't pay very close attention to any of that so I'm hoping you can possibly dismiss any of these persistent rumors. A hardcover version of the book would be tempting though the subsequent perfect bound books (such as the Monsters & Treasures of Aihrde) are great quality IMO.

Thanks,

M

As it stands right now Rune Lore will be released as a soft cover. If the pre-orders come in and justify bumping it up to a hardcover we may do that, but I would have to see.

The hardcover copies will more than likely be made in house. The complaints on the hardcovers we've made are two and as follows:

1) The most common complaint was print quality. We've address and fixed this problem. So that isn't an issue any longer.

2) The durability issues. I haven't heard much in the line of complaints, a few loose end sheets I think. People have reacted to the different style of binding. What you are seeing is a process called In Line Gluing. That is what we do. That means the book block is bound to the board. Normally the signatures are bound to an end sheet and the end sheet bound to block, giving you a "floating" book block. This is how your PH and MT and now the new CKG are done. I've actually abandoned my new CKG for one we did in house. Why? Because the in line gluing allows one to open the book to a page and it stays open (like a comic book). The signature approach doesn't allow one to do that. Its a giant pain in the ass for a book the size of the CKG. Smaller books are okay, but when i need to reference some crap int eh CKG and open it and it closes on me it irritates me to no end. So for game persons, in my opinion, the in line glue process is much more useful. As for durability I beat mine to hell and its still working.

In any case, the special made Rune Lore book that includes the Rune Mark character will ONLY be available in those 15 copies and will not be mass printed (3 are sold already).

Hope that helps!
Steve

[Troll Lord]

I really like this new logo -- and hope that Crusader Magazine (for which we await future issues Real Soon Now) takes this sort of logo. Right now, the Crusader's logo doesn't look like the word "crusader" and wouldn't grab the eye of a potential purchaser. Assuming we can get it into more hobby stores, comics shops, and Barnes & Noble.

Hell, I'd settle for it getting into this country. Somewhere, anywhere. My supplier's really let me down on the last issue.

Dragging the thread back on-topic, I'm quite fascinated by this product. It might well come in useful for my game further down the line. That poor girl on the cover's going to get frostbite in some funny places, though.

Great Britain? I think you may have dropped us an email. But we'll have to come up with a creative way to get it to you as from 25 onwards it won't be available in stores...unless they special order it from us.

The chick on the cover might be cold! But she is a dryad so can take it! She's mighty cute though. hahah

Steve

[redwullf]

So, the new C&C Logo is out.



My first impression was that it has almost a Star Wars feel to it.

My impression is that someone has swiped Conan's font:



By Crom Conan will not be pleased!

[Omote]

So, the new C&C Logo is out.

Swiped? Maybe. But as always the font seems to be altered by the indomitable font-splicer, Mr. P. Bradley. Consider me a fan.

~O

[Frost]

Another fan of the new logo here. Ha, just wish my books would match!

[Troll Lord]

So, the new C&C Logo is out.



My first impression was that it has almost a Star Wars feel to it.

My impression is that someone has swiped Conan's font:



By Crom Conan will not be pleased!

LOLOL That is great. That explains why Davis and I both like the new logo so much!

Of course to wrest this logo from us Conan and his crew will have to pass into the maw of tiamat and assail the Dens upon the Wretched Plains we call home!



Steve

[gideon_thorne]

So, the new C&C Logo is out.



My first impression was that it has almost a Star Wars feel to it.

But then I googled the logo, so maybe not



Is this logo just for the Winter Runes or will it become standard now for new products and follow on printings of established products?

Well, I was wanting to put "Unklar Strikes Back" or "Revenge of the Crna Ruk" underneath the logo. But for some strange reason Steve wouldn't go for it.

[redwullf]

LOLOL That is great. That explains why Davis and I both like the new logo so much!

Of course to wrest this logo from us Conan and his crew will have to pass into the maw of tiamat and assail the Dens upon the Wretched Plains we call home!



Steve

Oh, I didn't say he'd be able to get it back, just that he would not be pleased. Boo-hoo, I say.

[Relaxo]

Forget the font, swipe that woman!
Damn!

(and I say these things publicly? what the hell is wrong with my meds?)

[moriarty777]

As it stands right now Rune Lore will be released as a soft cover. If the pre-orders come in and justify bumping it up to a hardcover we may do that, but I would have to see.

The hardcover copies will more than likely be made in house. The complaints on the hardcovers we've made are two and as follows:

1) The most common complaint was print quality. We've address and fixed this problem. So that isn't an issue any longer.

2) The durability issues. I haven't heard much in the line of complaints, a few loose end sheets I think. People have reacted to the different style of binding. What you are seeing is a process called In Line Gluing. That is what we do. That means the book block is bound to the board. Normally the signatures are bound to an end sheet and the end sheet bound to block, giving you a "floating" book block. This is how your PH and MT and now the new CKG are done. I've actually abandoned my new CKG for one we did in house. Why? Because the in line gluing allows one to open the book to a page and it stays open (like a comic book). The signature approach doesn't allow one to do that. Its a giant pain in the ass for a book the size of the CKG. Smaller books are okay, but when i need to reference some crap int eh CKG and open it and it closes on me it irritates me to no end. So for game persons, in my opinion, the in line glue process is much more useful. As for durability I beat mine to hell and its still working.

In any case, the special made Rune Lore book that includes the Rune Mark character will ONLY be available in those 15 copies and will not be mass printed (3 are sold already).

Hope that helps!
Steve

Hey Steve -- You've answered my questions admirably. Thanks for that and the In Line Glue method explains a lot. I haven't had a chance to see any of the hardbacks you have done in house which is why I was curious. I never got around to ordering one of the first run CKGs and the other rulebooks which might have used the same process I got in perfect bound being what was available in the beginning.

You mention only 15 copies though (something I missed on the pre-order page). I only realized that now when I checked out the order link for the top-end bundle. Probably won't invest that much personally -- though it's a pretty damn cool package. A bit too close to the last kickstarter for my wallet. I'm sure others will hop on board.

M

[Sir Ironside]

Kind'a a mini hijack but still tied into the book.

If it turns out that Winter Runes justifies a HC, are there any plans to go with the matte covers, or are you sticking with the gloss covers? With the 5th printing of the core books getting close, this would be a good time to switch to matte, for the entire line.

I know there are some that want to keep the glossy look, but I personally would like to see the change to a matte cover. I'd re-buy the two core books (Which I'm thinking of doing regardless of the cover look.) and use the glossy for player reference and not really care if those books suffered such damage as cheesy finger-prints.

Plus, I think, it'd stand out, on the shelves, being surrounded by all that gloss, from other companies.

[MormonYoYoMan]

Since no one's bugged anyone lately with a hurry-up-hurry-up, I'll see if we can veer in a different direction.

There's an option in one of the not-Kickstarter pre-order choices where we can submit an idea for a village, an NPC, or fluffy pink bunny slippers. (I'm going from memory here.) When and how ought we submit such radical concepts?

[tylermo]

Sir, I understand some of your points regarding the matte look. That said, I own the matte ckg and a walsworth glossy version. I have to go with the latter. Matte is okay for some of the grognards, but other potential customers will judge a book by its cover. Some of these folks are coming from pathfinder, not to mention the trolls may have some tough competition from D&D 5. C&C product will have to measure up as close as possible.

[Lord Dynel]

Sir, I understand some of your points regarding the matte look. That said, I own the matte ckg and a walsworth glossy version. I have to go with the latter. Matte is okay for some of the grognards, but other potential customers will judge a book by its cover. Some of these folks are coming from pathfinder, not to mention the trolls may have some tough competition from D&D 5. C&C product will have to measure up as close as possible.

I say do whichever one is most cost-effective. I know some like the matte and some the glossy, but I really hope there's not a lot of people out there that won't buy the book if it's a matte fiinish and not a glossy one. I do see where you're coming from, tyler - I agree that it needs to be attention-grabbing so those not specifically looking for it on the shelves will glance this way. I'm of the opinion that I think a decision on the cover art (being a bit more evocative and attention getting) should be considered more than the matte/gloss decision. But that's my opinion. And that's not a knock against Pete, at all - I just agree with many others that the books should showcase a borderless, wraparound piece for the cover.

[shadowspawn]

>The Rune caster is tied to his totem (though I'm not fond of that name and it may change as it links the class and >his actions to the primeval) so the mana is tied to his totem as well. I'm musing on something akin to 'charges' as >you would find in wands, staffs, etc.

Maybe talisman instead of totem would work better. I'd like to see something along the lines of "The Magic Goes Away"

[Sir Ironside]

Sir, I understand some of your points regarding the matte look. That said, I own the matte ckg and a walsworth glossy version. I have to go with the latter. Matte is okay for some of the grognards, but other potential customers will judge a book by its cover. Some of these folks are coming from pathfinder, not to mention the trolls may have some tough competition from D&D 5. C&C product will have to measure up as close as possible.

It certainly comes down to personal preference. It doesn't bother me, that much if they go matte or glossy. Matte provides less glare and I'll stand by my assessment that it would stand out, a little better, side-by-side with all the glossy/glare you get from other companies books.

I maybe wrong, but I don't think matte caters to Grognards. An attractive cover grabs people, which is more important and is why TLG is changing their look for the 5th printing.

I wonder if WotC will make their reprints of AD&D matte or glossy.

[Frost]

I actually kind of like the matte, but I really don't care. I'm more interested on the contents inside.

[MormonYoYoMan]

Can mine be chocolate-covered graham?