Troll Lord Games

Due to Spell Resistance rule change all Monsters with a listed SR need to be incremented by 1 (one) in new printing. A monster that had an SR of 1 (5%) now has an effective SR of 0%, etc.

Rules on creating magic items that confer SR need to be revised as there is no reason to create such an item that grants SR of 1. Does SR stack now by items as everyone has an SR of 1 by default.

pg. 10 ARROWHAWK - remove "Perfect" from movement line.

pg. 15 CHIMERA - remove "Poor" from movement line.

pg. 16 CLOAKER - remove "Average" from movement line.

pg. 48 HIPPOGRIFF - remove (fly, average) from movement line.

pg. 61 NIGHTMARE - remove (fly, good) from movement line.

pg. 83 WILL-O’-WISP - remove (fly, perfect) from movement line.

pg. 89 - CALCULATING MAGIC ITEM GOLD PIECE VALUES table.
"Spell resistance 10,000 gp per point" this needs to be amended in light of new SR rules.

pg. 90 SENTIENT ITEM LESSER POWERS table

"51-54 Item grants wielder resistance to spell resistance (as elf)"

This power makes no sense.

All magic Items with a listed SR need to have that value increased by 1.

PDF copy of M&T has pages 86-88 BLANK with no content then starts at 86 with content and is normal thereafter.

Magic Item Creation. IMHO, this section needs clarification w/examples. See this thread for detailed discussion

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=9645

Is there a need to merging Magic Items from books like the Black Library and any new Magic Items that the Trolls have added?

Obviously we have Monsters & Treasure of Ahirde, but not sure if that's covered?

Spell Component cost from CKG?

Was the Shark Issue ever fixed?

Title page: Layout is mis-spelled

TheMetal1 wrote:Is there a need to merging Magic Items from books like the Black Library and any new Magic Items that the Trolls have added?

This thread isn't about that. Only fixing errata for next printing.

Regarding spell resistance at 10,000gp per point, what do you mean by "amended"?

Regarding that sword entry, it should read, "...resistance to sleep (as elf)".

Traveller wrote:Regarding spell resistance at 10,000gp per point, what do you mean by "amended"?

An MU doing a roll against SR uses the Siege Engine. If you make an item that confers an SR of 1 (10,000 gp cost) there is no benefit. Hence, amended or clarified.

Simple fix: change items that provide SR into items providing a SR bonus. For example, the Mantle of Spell Resistance provides SR 21 currently. Change the wording so it provides a +20 bonus to SR. The end result is the same in that the wearer is totally immune to spells. The only difference comes with beings with innate SR of greater than 1 wearing the Mantle. Before, the Mantle's SR would replace the innate SR. Now the Mantle's SR adds to the innate SR.

This opens the door to cursed items that reduce the SR by imposing a SR penalty.

Traveller wrote:Simple fix: change items that provide SR into items providing a SR bonus. For example, the Mantle of Spell Resistance provides SR 21 currently. Change the wording so it provides a +20 bonus to SR. The end result is the same in that the wearer is totally immune to spells. The only difference comes with beings with innate SR of greater than 1 wearing the Mantle. Before, the Mantle's SR would replace the innate SR. Now the Mantle's SR adds to the innate SR.

This opens the door to cursed items that reduce the SR by imposing a SR penalty.

Exactly as you just wrote. It does need to be in the new printing either PHB or more likely, M&T.

They may want to give the Mantle itself a rewrite since its been like that since the beginning, and in the beginning you could add your WIS or INT modifier to the roll. Don't know about you guys, but I am never giving out an item that makes anyone a 100% immune to spells. Back when it would have been effectively 90% against characters with an 18 attribute, maybe. Now, with a 100%? Never.

Treebore wrote:They may want to give the Mantle itself a rewrite since its been like that since the beginning, and in the beginning you could add your WIS or INT modifier to the roll. Don't know about you guys, but I am never giving out an item that makes anyone a 100% immune to spells. Back when it would have been effectively 90% against characters with an 18 attribute, maybe. Now, with a 100%? Never.

That item description is in error. SR costs G.P. 10,000/point. The GP value of that item is GP120,000. The most it could give is SR 12 (55%)

Mantle of Spell Resistance is mis-priced per the SR cost per point table.

It may not be correctly priced, because as I have said for years now, the SR of the Mantle is correct. I don't have to repeat this to Treebore because he knows the story, but for those not aware, according to Mac Golden the intent was to have items that reduced SR so it was possible to defeat the Mantle's SR of 21. He explicitly stated that the Mantle's SR was correct. Obviously those items that reduced SR never were created, but the Mantle remains.

Changing things to a SR bonus now makes it easier to create items that negatively impact SR, such as a +4 sword that reduces the SR of a creature successfully hit by 4 for the next 4 rounds. It also allows for the creation of cursed items that reduce SR, such as a cursed girdle that reduces SR by 10. With the system as it is now, trying to create a cursed SR item leads to an issue where the CK has to decide whether the cursed item's SR overrides the SR of a normal item. Changing things to a bonus/penalty system like with armor class will solve that problem as well as bring the game closer to author intent.

For example, a rogue wearing a Mantle of Spell Resistance dons the cursed girdle mentioned above. With the current setup does the Mantle override the girdle, or vice versa? Quite honestly, as written it's impossible to create cursed spell resistance items like the girdle, and because of how SR currently works the sword mentioned above is also impossible. With a bonus/penalty system if the rogue wears the Mantle and then accidentally dons the cursed girdle, their total SR is 11: the inherent SR of 1 all creatures have, +20 for the Mantle, -10 for the cursed girdle. However, here's the thing about cursed SR items: where does the curse stop?

Using the rogue from our previous example, if he were to take the Mantle off his SR would reduce to -9, meaning he would not get a saving throw at all for anything. The simplest way to go here would be to simply have the SR never reduce below 1. However, there should still be a penalty for having the cursed item, which can be expressed by simply subtracting 1 from the die roll for every two points of SR curse. For example, the rogue without the Mantle but with the girdle would still have SR 1, but would have a -5 penalty to the die roll. You could also increase the target number the same amount, which does the same thing but without subtraction.

Traveller wrote:It may not be correctly priced, because as I have said for years now, the SR of the Mantle is correct. I don't have to repeat this to Treebore because he knows the story, but for those not aware, according to Mac Golden the intent was to have items that reduced SR so it was possible to defeat the Mantle's SR of 21. He explicitly stated that the Mantle's SR was correct.

Good data. Now we know that the Mantle of Spell Resistance is horribly under-priced per the table.

And yet, if I recall correctly it's the most expensive miscellaneous magic item in the game.

Arduin wrote:PDF copy of M&T has pages 86-88 BLANK with no content then starts at 86 with content and is normal thereafter.

What PDF copy do you have? The one I have has no blank pages. Granted, it was the PDF copy TLG sent out when the did the Classic Monsters Kickstarter. I went in with the top package and they sent out PDFs direct to backers for all the books they received. Was there an update since you got it?

M

TheMetal1 wrote:Was the Shark Issue ever fixed?

Yes... it is in the PDF version of the book and it was included in the softcover limited-printing of the M&T book they did when it was first released. Presumably, it is also in the currently available 'flip-book'.

M

moriarty777 wrote:
What PDF copy do you have?

M

Whatever the last edition/print is that RPGNow sold.

Arduin wrote:

moriarty777 wrote:
What PDF copy do you have?

M

Whatever the last edition/print is that RPGNow sold.

I just redownloaded them, and they're fine.

kreider204 wrote:

Arduin wrote:

moriarty777 wrote:
What PDF copy do you have?

M

Whatever the last edition/print is that RPGNow sold.

I just redownloaded them, and they're fine.

Yep, they fixed it.

As mentioned on the other thread:

viewtopic.php?f=19&t=11064&hilit=errata

Just to point out, this is the place to post errata. I can no longer maintain that thread in Keeper Advice.

Traveller wrote:Just to point out, this is the place to post errata. I can no longer maintain that thread in Keeper Advice.

Yup, I was posting it as a reminder about the errata document linked there, FYI.

No worries. Just making it clear for the uninitiated. Lol.

Any chance we could get more monster illustrations? There aren't that many entries without one, and it would be really nice to have a complete set. If space is a consideration, then I'd suggest leaving out those with real world equivalents - we don't really need illustrations for horses or baboons as much as we do for yrthak and otyugh ...

kreider204 wrote:Any chance we could get more monster illustrations? There aren't that many entries without one, and it would be really nice to have a complete set. If space is a consideration, then I'd suggest leaving out those with real world equivalents - we don't really need illustrations for horses or baboons as much as we do for yrthak and otyugh ...

Yes! Great idea.