Troll Lord Games

Hi, I have been looking around recently at C&C stuff, and have even bought a few pieces (PHB, Monsters & Treasure, The Book of Familiars), but I have also made the odd misstep or two... Like buying the Classic Monsters book, only to find that I really didn't need to.

It's all a bit confusing with current and past edition books being sold as to which ones I should get.

What printing Castle Keepers Guide should I be looking for? Which GM screen is the newest?

Thanks in advance!

Hi there and welcome.

For the newest stuff, try the 4th printings + o' the PHBs,

the 3rd printings + o' the M&Ts,

and any Castle Keepers Guide.

This thread might also help u, or confuse u more:

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=15036

Welcome to the Crusade!

Enjoy the game,

Rhu.

Great to hear of another convert. Despite the different printings, any of the CK screens will serve their purpose well. As far as Castle Keeper's Guide, I'd wait until the latest printing is published; it's a bit of an optional (though very useful text) part of gameplay and the latest edition should be nice and shiny, if the PHB and the Monsters & Treasure books are any indications.

slimykuotoan wrote:Hi there and welcome.

For the newest stuff, try the 4th printings + o' the PHBs,

the 3rd printings + o' the M&Ts,

and any Castle Keepers Guide.

ok, good info and thanks for the link.

Help me understand the CKG thing though... It doesn't matter which printing? I also don't see it for sale in the TLG store... It is a bit of a mystery!

I also don't see a GM screen there... Do they sell such a thing?

Litzen Tallister wrote:Great to hear of another convert. Despite the different printings, any of the CK screens will serve their purpose well. As far as Castle Keeper's Guide, I'd wait until the latest printing is published; it's a bit of an optional (though very useful text) part of gameplay and the latest edition should be nice and shiny, if the PHB and the Monsters & Treasure books are any indications.

ok, great, that helps. So the CKG is undergoing a reprint? I will wait then.

Is there any kind of ETA for a new version and a GM screen?

Thanks for the help guys, I do appreciate it.

Rhuvein wrote:Welcome to the Crusade!

Enjoy the game,

Rhu.

Thanks Rhu

Vesavius wrote: Is there any kind of ETA for a new version and a GM screen?

The CKG is on the imminent side of things, as it's the last of the 'three sisters' kickstarter for PHB, M&T, and CKG. As far as screens go, I believe the casebound screens (TLG 80124) in the online store are the most recently printed screens (though I could be wrong).

Litzen Tallister wrote:

Vesavius wrote: Is there any kind of ETA for a new version and a GM screen?

The CKG is on the imminent side of things, as it's the last of the 'three sisters' kickstarter for PHB, M&T, and CKG. As far as screens go, I believe the casebound screens (TLG 80124) in the online store are the most recently printed screens (though I could be wrong).

D'oh... I actually missed that... Thanks for the pointer.

Just as a heads up, the CKG coming out is the full colour version of the one currently available.

PHBs:

4th printing: black and white

5th and 6th printings: full colour

M&Ts:

3rd printing: black & white

4th printing: full colour

Just so you know, the CKG is a book of options. It's not necessary to have it to play. All you need is the PHB and M&T. The most current printings are the 6th print PHB and the 4th print M&T. Though any printings can be used together. I use the 4th printing PHB and 3rd printing M&T for my games and some of my players are using 4th printing, 5th printing, and even 3rd printing PHB.

And welcome to the Crusade.

R-

Like Rigon said, the CKG is completely optional. Everything you need to start is in the PHB and M&T. I suggest getting those two books first, play the game, and see if you like it. Then, think about investing in the CKG.

I would say everything but that might be daunting.

PHB, M&T, Classic Monsters, Engineering Dungeons, and then whatever modules and supplements strike your fancy. I would consider the CKG to be in the "accessory" category so get it if you like that stuff.

Rigon wrote:Just so you know, the CKG is a book of options. It's not necessary to have it to play.

And welcome to the Crusade.

R-

ok, great, I will hold off until a new print is out and take it from there. Thanks.

Can I just take a moment to say, before letting this thread sink, how impressed I am with the community here. Definitely helps sell the game to me and make it all something that I want to be part of.

Vesavius wrote:Can I just take a moment to say, before letting this thread sink, how impressed I am with the community here. Definitely helps sell the game to me and make it all something that I want to be part of.

Yeah, that's mostly me. You're welcome.

Vesavius wrote:Can I just take a moment to say, before letting this thread sink, how impressed I am with the community here. Definitely helps sell the game to me and make it all something that I want to be part of.

It's a great game, which naturally attracts a great community.

Buttmonkey wrote:Like Rigon said, the CKG is completely optional. Everything you need to start is in the PHB and M&T. I suggest getting those two books first, play the game, and see if you like it. Then, think about investing in the CKG.

Welcome, Vesavius!

I can't stress this enough. For starters, go with the PHB and M&T, like Buttmonkey and Rigon (and others) have stated. If you're going to expand after that, I'd actually suggest more monsters (Classic Monsters, M&ToA, heck, even the S&W Tome of Horrors would work well with a little conversion) or maybe some setting or over the CKG. I like it, but it's a bunch of add-ons that aren't really vital to the game. I've always suggested to run a campaign/arc/number of sessions without any options to see what you like, what you think is missing or what you want to change. Then add stuff, take stuff away, or what have you.

Vesavius wrote:Can I just take a moment to say, before letting this thread sink, how impressed I am with the community here. Definitely helps sell the game to me and make it all something that I want to be part of.

And yes, I agree. It's a great community, with usually pretty good discussions going on.

Lord Dynel wrote:

Buttmonkey wrote:Like Rigon said, the CKG is completely optional. Everything you need to start is in the PHB and M&T. I suggest getting those two books first, play the game, and see if you like it. Then, think about investing in the CKG.

Welcome, Vesavius!

I can't stress this enough. For starters, go with the PHB and M&T, like Buttmonkey and Rigon (and others) have stated. If you're going to expand after that, I'd actually suggest more monsters (Classic Monsters etc) I've always suggested to run a campaign/arc/number of sessions without any options to see what you like, what you think is missing or what you want to change. Then add stuff, take stuff away, or what have you.

Good advice. I am running a Keep on the Borderlands/ Temple of Elemental Evil hybrid game right now and getting a really good handle on the system. I think I will def be investing in a CKG at the very least going forward

Vesavius wrote:

Lord Dynel wrote:

Buttmonkey wrote:Like Rigon said, the CKG is completely optional. Everything you need to start is in the PHB and M&T. I suggest getting those two books first, play the game, and see if you like it. Then, think about investing in the CKG.

Welcome, Vesavius!

I can't stress this enough. For starters, go with the PHB and M&T, like Buttmonkey and Rigon (and others) have stated. If you're going to expand after that, I'd actually suggest more monsters (Classic Monsters etc) I've always suggested to run a campaign/arc/number of sessions without any options to see what you like, what you think is missing or what you want to change. Then add stuff, take stuff away, or what have you.

Good advice. I am running a Keep on the Borderlands/ Temple of Elemental Evil hybrid game right now and getting a really good handle on the system. I think I will def be investing in a CKG at the very least going forward

Keep o/t Borderlands is an excellent module to run with C&C, in my opinion. I ran a (very small part of) it, and thought it went well. Good luck on your game...keep us posted on it!

I ran a group through Keep on the Borderlands a few years ago. One issue that cropped up was the cleric spell sound burst. That spell alone can take out large numbers of humanoids in the caves. I compensated by adding additional waves of humanoids if a sound burst wiped out the listed monsters.

You should be good to go running old TSR modules through mid-levels. However, at high levels, the modules don't translate as well to C&C without some adjustments. Saving throws scale much differently in C&C. That scaling difference isn't really noticeable early on, but when your PCs start hitting high level, it can make a big difference. For example, high level PCs in 1E have much better saving throws versus magic than a comparably leveled PC in C&C. That makes high level encounters more dangerous in C&C. You will need to keep that in mind if you want to run your party through the D series modules from TSR, for example.

Definitely the Players Handbook as well as Monster and Treasure.

Also consider the Castlekeeper's Guide (for the optional rules material), Monsters and Treasure of Aihrde, and Classic Monsters (if you need more monsters).

Many other good products, but you don't need to overwhelm yourself at first. Keep it simple.

I personally don't consider the CKG as solely a book of options. There are options there certainly, but there are also large scale combat rules, stronghold construct rules, high level character rules, tracking rules, underwater combat, adventure creation, etc.

For me, it's rather like the AD&D DM's Guide, with some AD&D Wilderness Survival Guide thrown in.

CKG!!

All this discussion had me re-reading many sections today . . it's a superb tome for C&C.

I love to just open the book to any page or section and I see loads of valuable info. It makes me want to run a game. Totally excellent idea generator for me!