Great Scimitar

Open Discussion on all things C&C from new product to general questions to the rules, the laws, and the chaos.
Post Reply
User avatar
Captain_K
Greater Lore Drake
Posts: 2315
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:37 pm
Location: North Coast

Great Scimitar

Post by Captain_K »

This thing does 2d6 like the 2-H sword. The bastard is d10 but 2-H d12. How is the Greater Scimitar NOT a 2-H weapon?

Is this a troll type-o or is this intentional and thus simple the most 1-H damaging weapon on the list?

Thoughts?
Wow, Another Natural One! You guys are a sink hole for luck. Stay away from my dice.

User avatar
DMSamuel
Red Cap
Posts: 355
Joined: Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:48 am
Location: Downstate NY
Contact:

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by DMSamuel »

I would houserule that the Great Scimitar IS a 2-H weapon. My reasoning is thus:

1) The Scimitar (non-Great) does 1d6 damage, weighs 3 pounds, costs 15gp, and is a 1-handed weapon.

2) The Great Scimitar does 2d6 damage (2x the scimitar), weighs 6 pounds (2x the scimitar), costs 55gp (more than 2x the scimitar). Though it does not designate 2-handed, most of it's characteristics are 2x (or more) the non-Great scimitar, so the number of hands needed to wield the sword should be 2x as well.
~DMSamuel
---
Website: RPG Musings
Actual Play C&C in Aihrde: Epi 1, Epi 2
Actual Play Podcast (5e): D&DeBrief

InFurno
Skobbit
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 9:35 pm

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by InFurno »

Wouldn't the extra cost of the great scimitar be the explanation as to why it is superior to both the scimitar and the two handed sword? If the great scimitar is two handed, the only difference between it and the two handed sword is 1 less EV, but you pay almost double the cost.

I think this is consistent with the flamberge, which Is one handed for 2d4+2 damage. This is, on average, the same damage as 2d6 but it weighs less than both the great scimitar and the two handed sword. However, the flamberge is more expensive at 75gp, which is a balancing factor for the reduced EV.

I think the take away is that all weapons are not created equal, and are significantly balanced around cost (although not always). Also though the cost delta is not huge for the mundane versions of the swords, it really starts to add up when looking at expert (x10) or masterwork (x25). In the end, certain weapons are simply more effective than other weapons (in real life and in CnC).

There is also an aspect of "rules mastery" that rewards those who take the time to look through all the weapons, and find the ones that have powerful edge cases. That seems to be a common element of games to reward putting time and effort into the rules (two weapon fighting with dual flamberges anyone?)

Either way, it it is fun to argue and debate about!

User avatar
Captain_K
Greater Lore Drake
Posts: 2315
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:37 pm
Location: North Coast

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by Captain_K »

Great to hear from you here. Great point of view.
Wow, Another Natural One! You guys are a sink hole for luck. Stay away from my dice.

User avatar
Captain_K
Greater Lore Drake
Posts: 2315
Joined: Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:37 pm
Location: North Coast

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by Captain_K »

6# sword in one hand, by view of the thing it is heavy at the end... you better be strong to use this thing.
Wow, Another Natural One! You guys are a sink hole for luck. Stay away from my dice.

User avatar
DMSamuel
Red Cap
Posts: 355
Joined: Thu Jun 19, 2014 2:48 am
Location: Downstate NY
Contact:

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by DMSamuel »

InFurno wrote:
Thu Jul 09, 2020 4:20 am
Wouldn't the extra cost of the great scimitar be the explanation as to why it is superior to both the scimitar and the two handed sword? If the great scimitar is two handed, the only difference between it and the two handed sword is 1 less EV, but you pay almost double the cost.

I considered leaving the Great Scimitar as a 1-H weapon due to the the price difference when I was making my houserule... But ultimately I decided against it because it's not like the thing costs 5000 or even 500gp, it's a mere 55gp - so it didn't seem an insurmountable cost that it would be a barrier to purchasing it, even at low levels.

I will admit I did not think about Masterwork versions... so perhaps I need to revisit it?


There is one other thing too... A scimitar (Great or otherwise) might not be a weapon that is available in the area the party is in... so if they never find one in a weapon shop they won't be able to buy it, will they?
~DMSamuel
---
Website: RPG Musings
Actual Play C&C in Aihrde: Epi 1, Epi 2
Actual Play Podcast (5e): D&DeBrief

InFurno
Skobbit
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Feb 05, 2014 9:35 pm

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by InFurno »

DMSamuel wrote:
Thu Jul 09, 2020 5:06 pm
InFurno wrote:
Thu Jul 09, 2020 4:20 am
Wouldn't the extra cost of the great scimitar be the explanation as to why it is superior to both the scimitar and the two handed sword? If the great scimitar is two handed, the only difference between it and the two handed sword is 1 less EV, but you pay almost double the cost.

I considered leaving the Great Scimitar as a 1-H weapon due to the the price difference when I was making my houserule... But ultimately I decided against it because it's not like the thing costs 5000 or even 500gp, it's a mere 55gp - so it didn't seem an insurmountable cost that it would be a barrier to purchasing it, even at low levels.

I will admit I did not think about Masterwork versions... so perhaps I need to revisit it?


There is one other thing too... A scimitar (Great or otherwise) might not be a weapon that is available in the area the party is in... so if they never find one in a weapon shop they won't be able to buy it, will they?
That is a good point about availability, finding one could be a nice side quest. Another thing is that not all classes are proficient with the Great scimitar, which limits its use to mostly the martial classes who are a bit more skilled. For instance, a Druid can use a scimitar but not a great scimitar.

serleran
Mogrl
Posts: 13866
Joined: Mon Oct 13, 2008 7:00 am

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by serleran »

Assassins hurling great scimitars is just all kinds of fun. Make it a two-handed weapon and it becomes, well, maybe even cooler... I guess that depends on what you like.

User avatar
Lurker
Greater Lore Drake
Posts: 4055
Joined: Thu Jan 18, 2007 8:00 am
Location: Oklahoma

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by Lurker »

I always thought the great scimitar was the weapon used in ceremonial beheadings and the like. If it was, then yes it should be a 2 handed weapon.

It wasn't really a 'combat' weapon being to heavy for a normal person to use effectively in melee, but if one was strong enough and hit accurately, it could easily take off a head, bifurcate a person etc. If you missed, well hopefully you have good armor against those little puny people with sharp sticks and fast normal scimitars
"And so I am become a knight of the Kingdom of Dreams and Shadows!" - Mark Twain

Forgive all spelling errors.

Knight Errant & Humble C&C Society Contributor
C&C Society

User avatar
Traveller
Greater Lore Drake
Posts: 2024
Joined: Tue May 02, 2006 7:00 am

Re: Great Scimitar

Post by Traveller »

The prints prior to the 6th all list the Great Scimitar as a two-handed weapon, noted by the use of an asterisk. The asterisk for the Great Scimitar is missing from the 6th and 7th prints, and I know I didn't call for its removal. I never would have noticed it without seeing this thread as I use the personalized leather 5th print Steve sent me despite having two loose 6th prints hanging around and a third as part of the slipcase set.

So, Great Scimitar is a two-handed weapon, and given the missing asterisk, quite understandable how the discussion could crop up.For the guy making jokes about the weight, the Great Scimitar was originally 14 pounds before I put it and all the other swords on a diet for the fifth print. At 14 pounds it was a wall-hanger, i.e. a sword only suitable as a decoration on a wall.

Post Reply