Troll Lord Games

Here is a more fleshed out concept from some ideas that have been bouncing about my mind since a recent thread on RPGnet about "Single-Class Campaigns".
All Wizard Campaign
Setting: Something similar, if not the same as the Wizarding world of the Harry Potter books. You either have magic or you're mundane. The affairs of those with magic have little to do with the affairs of those who don't. So, there's very little crossover between the two. For the purposes of this kind of campaign, those who aren't wizards can be assumed to gain no more than 3 to 5 class levels, ever. Thus, they aren't necessarily effective as PC Class material.
Required Class Changes:
1. More hit points per level. A flat bonus of +2 Hit Points per level, every level. With little to no healing magic and low hit points to begin with, it just wouldn't be "fun" to have the characters dropping like flies every other combat (if combat happens frequently).

2. Alter Armor Restrictions; Allow Leather Coat, Padded and maybe Leather Armor to be worn by Wizards/Illusionists.

3. Alter Weapon Restrictions; Allow wider variety of weapons; Longswords and similar "thin" weapons. (Probably no Battleaxes) Melee combat should still be a rare thing.

4. Allow unlimited castings of 0-Level Spells.

5. Beef up Prestidigation to a level you are comfortable with that would fit the level of "spontaneous" magical effects you want to show.

6. Add "Wand" magic, which could be limited to minor combat "charms" and "defensive" charms. (See Below examples.)
Gameplay Assumption Changes:
1. All foes should have generally lower Armor Classes to ensure at least semi-regular hits by the Wizard characters.

2. Few foes should be capable of single round massive damage strike.
"Wand" Magic

Each character should have a wand for performing their "unlimited" Prestidigation castings as well as casting 'minor' combat 'charms'. These charms should be either defensive or offensive in nature would work best for causing minor damage and providing limited defensive bonuses. The following charms are modeled after the limited effects of certain combat related 0-level spells from NWN2. They should be treated like "melee" combat actions, thus there's no real "casting times". They would require to-hit rolls to connect and failed to hits can be assumed to be "fizzles" or whatever the CK deems appropriate.

Each one of these would take the place of a standard combat attack action.
Wounding Strike
Damage: 1d3
Range: 30ft maximum. (10' is short range, 11'-20' is medium, 21'-30' is long range)
Effect: Could be acid, fire, cold, electrical, bludgeoning, piercing or whatever an individual wizard chooses. I would recommend that a wizard chooses a particular type of damage and that's more or less his/her normal mode of attack. However, if one wants, this could be changed with a SIEGE Engine check and a penalty of 3 points to the PC's initiative roll. The wizard simply has to make a successful to hit roll against the target's AC.
Defensive Shield
Effect: The wizard can create a minor defensive shield that has the effect of temporarily raising his/her armor class until his/her next combat action. Thus the wizard is protected from the start of his/her turn until the very next turn he/she takes. The effect of this charm is an increase of +2 to the Wizard's armor class, which may or may not be successful in deflecting a Wounding Strike attack. This effect is accumulative with Shield and other AC raising defensive full spells.
Stunning Strike
Damage: Stuns target for 1d2 Rounds
Range: 30ft maximum. (10' is short range, 11'-20' is medium, 21'-30' is long range)
Effect: Similar to Wounding Strike, only the effect is a stun on the target that lasts 1d2 rounds. There is no save against this attack, a successful to hit roll is assumed to strike the solar plexus or similar vulnerable area of the target.
Full Spells

The regular allotment of spells per day remain the same, for the most part, the standard spells should have little or no changes made to them.

Due to the lower overall hit points of wizards, it might be prudent to put some sort of limit upon the total amount of damage the standard spells can cause. Fireball, for example, is an incredibly potent spell that would still remain very dangerous/deadly to a while party of wizards (even with the increased hit points) while doing only 5d6 damage. 30 Points of damage can be an instant kill by itself, I believe that an upper limit of probably 7 or 8d6 would work fine.

I would recommend looking at the spells as they become available to the characters and determine what would work best for the story you want to tell.

--

Tell me what you think.

These changes are NOT meant to be used in a "standard" C&C game, they would create far more powerful wizards, overall.

No changes need to be made to the XP chart, since all PCs would be wizards/illusionists and operate under the same rules.[/b]
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I'm not sure why you would want to mimic the Harry Potterverse as a campaign setting, but if you are going to do it, you should note that there is LOTS of healing magic referenced in the books.

Buttmonkey wrote:
I'm not sure why you would want to mimic the Harry Potterverse as a campaign setting, but if you are going to do it, you should note that there is LOTS of healing magic referenced in the books.

Some people like that.

The main goal is to create something that would work nicely for an "All Wizard" campaign. The Harry Potter 'verse was just used for some inspiration.

EDIT: The three "Wand Magic" examples don't necessarily have to be the limit upon what is available to Wizards. They are meant as jumping off points for very low-powered, but useful effects. (I see no reason why one can't make their wand into a "magical" item with bonuses to hit, damage and add to defensive uses as the campaign progresses.)
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You should make it clear, if you want a Potter-style game, that every spell has a verbal component. It also seems that anyone can cast dispel magic, or, at least, use a "cantrip" to interrupt another... I believe they called it Expelliarmus or something.

Of course, if you don't want a Potter game, the other changes can work.

serleran wrote:
You should make it clear, if you want a Potter-style game, that every spell has a verbal component. It also seems that anyone can cast dispel magic, or, at least, use a "cantrip" to interrupt another... I believe they called it Expelliarmus or something.

Of course, if you don't want a Potter game, the other changes can work.

Expelliarmus - I would put that under the "beefed" up Prestidigation Category or make it another one of those "Wand Spells". (I have no idea if that is spelled right.)

I would do the same thing with the "Diswanding" Spell. It would require a To-Hit, have a certain amount of damage and that would be the "Challenge Level" for the Strength SIEGE engine check to keep ahold of one's wand. Seeing as Harry was about to diswand a fairly potent wizard in the recent movie, it might need something extra. (Or Harry just happens to have more than a few levels under his belt.)
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Only advice I have to offer, for a HP campaign, ditch vancian magic altogether. It is totally unsuited to the magical method in HP.

Something more skill check like would be more appropriate. ^_^
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gideon_thorne wrote:
Only advice I have to offer, for a HP campaign, ditch vancian magic altogether. It is totally unsuited to the magical method in HP.

Something more skill check like would be more appropriate. ^_^

That might be a possibility for wanting to cast additional spells after using up all of the allotted spells slots available per level, with an increasing Challenge Level cost to account for fatigue that is accumulative.

My goal isn't to 100% emulate or create a HP world. I am mostly using that as a suggested kind of setting to invoke certain thoughts. I like the Vancian style magic system and would rather not abandon that altogether.
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At least in a HP world, having "schools of magic" actually makes sense.

It might also make sense to replace the fire-and-forget system of spellcasting with a spellcheck system. There are numerous instances of fumbled and miscast spells.

-Fizz

http://www.hp-lexicon.org/index-2.html

Utterly required reading for the HP aficianado.

The Encyclopedia of Spells will tell you the basics of what you need.

I would make one class in an HP game: Wizard. You might go with Squib, too, for members of the Wizarding World who can only manage the equivalent of cantrips.

The books and the movies show, as far as I can tell, no limit to the number of spells you can cast as long as you have your wand. And even then, some of the more powerful wizards can cast minor spells without their wand (Dumbledore's done it once or twice).

So really, once you know your spell, the real difference is in experience in the spell. The Magic and Magical Theory section of the above sight gives a good breakdown of the different fields of study, the two most important of which are Charms (Charisma), Transfigurations (Wisdom), and Potions (Intelligence).

Those should be the three primary abilities of a wizard. Each wizard would get a +1 per level to put into a specific field, showing focus, and may put a +1 on a specific spell in each field each level, showing further in-depth study. Whenever a spell is cast or a potion is made, the wizard would make a roll for that skill and add any modifiers for the spell. The degree of success determines the opponent's CL to save against the spell, if the target is such that it would get a save.

For example, at 1st level, Harry might have a +1 in Charms and a +1 in Wingardium Leviosa, Vanishing, and Forgetfulness Potion. When rolling to cast Wingardium Leviosa, he'd add +1 for his level, +1 for Charms, and +1 for specializing in Wingardium Leviosa, and +3 for Charisma (Harry's got an 18 in the books for sure), for a total of +6.

I'd say that a First Year Wizard is a 1st level wizard... and each year a wizard would gain one level through training, such that upon graduating, most would be 7th level wizards. Some might be more powerful through additional adventures (such as Harry, Ron, and Hermione, of course), and others less so, though rarely.

Just some random thoughts... maybe more later.
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Hmm... maybe I shouldn't have suggested a "Harry Potter Like" world, everyone seems to be getting caught up in Harry Potterisms, which is far from my intent.

My intent is to add minor changes to the C&C Wizard and Illusionist in order to be able to run an "All Wizard" campaign without requiring a major rewrite of the rules. Just making wizards/illusionists mildly more potent and capable so they don't get slammed and destroyed like sheets of paper.
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Nelzie wrote:
Hmm... maybe I shouldn't have suggested a "Harry Potter Like" world, everyone seems to be getting caught up in Harry Potterisms, which is far from my intent.

My intent is to add minor changes to the C&C Wizard and Illusionist in order to be able to run an "All Wizard" campaign without requiring a major rewrite of the rules. Just making wizards/illusionists mildly more potent and capable so they don't get slammed and destroyed like sheets of paper.

lol ... hard to avoid considering the recent release of the latest movie and upcoming release of the final book in the next few days.

That being said, there's some interesting material in TLG's 'Path of the Magi' which showcases a school of magic.

Moriarty the Red
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Nelzie wrote:
Hmm... maybe I shouldn't have suggested a "Harry Potter Like" world, everyone seems to be getting caught up in Harry Potterisms, which is far from my intent.

My intent is to add minor changes to the C&C Wizard and Illusionist in order to be able to run an "All Wizard" campaign without requiring a major rewrite of the rules. Just making wizards/illusionists mildly more potent and capable so they don't get slammed and destroyed like sheets of paper.

Oh... well...
In that case...

You should use Ars Magica s a model for the set-up. As mentioned elsewhere here, most non-wizards should top out at about 5th level and be little more than fodder or grogs.

Eliminate the different spellcasting classes and have just one spellcasting class, the Wizard.

Wizards should have access to all spells at the lowest level they can be accessed by any class.

They should gain a bonus number of cantrips per day equal to their intelligence bonus. Also, they should gain one cantrip per level that they can cast as many times per day as desired.

Plus, wizards should memorize and cast spells more like sorcerers from D&D; i.e., the number of spells per day is the number of spells that can be memorized, however, instead of "forgetting" spells, you cast them with spell points, which is equal to the number of spells you can memorize per the normal table. So if you can memorize three 3rd level spells, the wizard would have three different 3rd level spells memorized and be able to cast them a total of three times per day in any combination. Spell casting slots are regained through rest and meditation as normal, and spells can be forgotten and memorized as per normal.

All wizards start out with a number of hit points equal to their constitution +1d4, +1d4 hit points + constitution modifier per level starting at 2nd. This guarantees that wizards can take a few magic missile hits and wounding strikes at 1st level without the spell always being an automatic take down. Yes, this makes wizard PCs and NPCs more powerful than fighters and barbarians, even, but they are supposed to be; in-game you can say that their body is reinforced by magic. There's plenty of examples where wizards that should die did not in various literature.

Finally, wizards age slowly automatically (if this is a human-centric campaign). They age one year physically in a number of years equal to their level. For example, a 10th level wizard ages only 1 year for every 10 that pass.

Some good campaign settings to use for this kind of game include Mystara's Alphatia or Glantri (I still say Rowling played a D&D game based in Glantri's Great School of Magic when she was younger and won't admit it); Changeling Earth (Saberhagen's Empire of the East/Swords series); a Middle Earth style setting (each wizard PC can rule or influence a kingdom); Hyboria's Stygia (each wizard is a member of the Black Circle, seeking ultimate power and rulership of Stygia); and so forth.

Oh, and to tempt the PC's... perhaps you can allow them to make magic items such that, when their power is vested in them, their casting level (effective casting level and power slots, though not memorization) is increased dramatically, perhaps, say, doubled. However, when they lose the item (c.f. Sauron, Thoth-Amon) their casting power entirely is halved. So if the wizard were 10th level and placed all his power in a staff, while bearing the staff all his spells are cast and he has a number of casting slots as though he were 20th level; however, if he does not have the staff, his spell-casting powers in their entirety are only at 5th level. Perhaps it need not be all-or-nothing; maybe a wizard can bind part of his power into an item, say, 5 levels out of 10, and thus that would be doubled for casting purposes to 10 for a total of 15 levels effective spell casting. When lost, the wizard would have an effective spell casting level of 7 (round down, of course).
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jamesmishler wrote:
You should use Ars Magica s a model for the set-up. As mentioned elsewhere here, most non-wizards should top out at about 5th level and be little more than fodder or grogs.

No, no and no. I despise the setting of Ars Magica with a passion. To me, it is a hateful, hurtful setting that I would rather never visit.

jamesmishler wrote:
Eliminate the different spellcasting classes and have just one spellcasting class, the Wizard.

I am considering making Clerics and Druids more or less fit into the same mold, with the same limitations, same hit points, same BtH progression and make them all use the Wizard/Illusionist XP Chart.

jamesmishler wrote:
Wizards should have access to all spells at the lowest level they can be accessed by any class.

They should gain a bonus number of cantrips per day equal to their intelligence bonus. Also, they should gain one cantrip per level that they can cast as many times per day as desired.

I want them to have unlimited use of 0-level spells, which would include the aforementioned "wand spells".

jamesmishler wrote:
Plus, wizards should memorize and cast spells more like sorcerers from D&D; i.e., the number of spells per day is the number of spells that can be memorized, however, instead of "forgetting" spells, you cast them with spell points, which is equal to the number of spells you can memorize per the normal table. So if you can memorize three 3rd level spells, the wizard would have three different 3rd level spells memorized and be able to cast them a total of three times per day in any combination. Spell casting slots are regained through rest and meditation as normal, and spells can be forgotten and memorized as per normal.

Yes, they would be able to case any spell from their spellbook, up to their allotted spell slots. After that, they would need to make SIEGE Engine checks, which would have an accumulative penalty to signify exhaustion.

jamesmishler wrote:
All wizards start out with a number of hit points equal to their constitution +1d4, +1d4 hit points + constitution modifier per level starting at 2nd. This guarantees that wizards can take a few magic missile hits and wounding strikes at 1st level without the spell always being an automatic take down. Yes, this makes wizard PCs and NPCs more powerful than fighters and barbarians, even, but they are supposed to be; in-game you can say that their body is reinforced by magic. There's plenty of examples where wizards that should die did not in various literature.

I don't need them to be overly powerful. Just a few extra hit points, period. I envision most combat to be done via the "Wand Spells" which, with a top end of 3 points of damage, without magical bonuses, would fit nicely for the relatively small amount of hit points that wizards typically have.

EDIT: I would set an in setting reason as to why Wizards aren't tossing about Fireballs or even Magic Missile at one another when/if they fight one another. One, it could be considered 'poor form'. Two, there could be prohibitions on casting certain spells upon another sentient being, such as that one curse from the Harry Potter books.

"You can't cast fireball upon another sentient, due to the terrible pain and common desecration that occurs to the body. It is not only frowned upon, it is also considered a criminal act! Those who cast such spells upon another sentient are hunted down by the (Insert Wizard goverment body) and are typically put to death immediately!"

I can see certain rules/laws being put into place in a society that contains literally hundreds of thousands to nearly a million or so wizards.

jamesmishler wrote:
Finally, wizards age slowly automatically (if this is a human-centric campaign). They age one year physically in a number of years equal to their level. For example, a 10th level wizard ages only 1 year for every 10 that pass.

I don't want that to be automatic.

jamesmishler wrote:
Some good campaign settings to use for this kind of game include Mystara's Alphatia or Glantri (I still say Rowling played a D&D game based in Glantri's Great School of Magic when she was younger and won't admit it); Changeling Earth (Saberhagen's Empire of the East/Swords series); a Middle Earth style setting (each wizard PC can rule or influence a kingdom); Hyboria's Stygia (each wizard is a member of the Black Circle, seeking ultimate power and rulership of Stygia); and so forth.

Oh, and to tempt the PC's... perhaps you can allow them to make magic items such that, when their power is vested in them, their casting level (effective casting level and power slots, though not memorization) is increased dramatically, perhaps, say, doubled. However, when they lose the item (c.f. Sauron, Thoth-Amon) their casting power entirely is halved. So if the wizard were 10th level and placed all his power in a staff, while bearing the staff all his spells are cast and he has a number of casting slots as though he were 20th level; however, if he does not have the staff, his spell-casting powers in their entirety are only at 5th level. Perhaps it need not be all-or-nothing; maybe a wizard can bind part of his power into an item, say, 5 levels out of 10, and thus that would be doubled for casting purposes to 10 for a total of 15 levels effective spell casting. When lost, the wizard would have an effective spell casting level of 7 (round down, of course).

That's to much power at one time.

I am thinking more or less minor bonuses and maybe some useful magical gadgets. I want magic, I also want "low powered".
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moriarty777 wrote:
lol ... hard to avoid considering the recent release of the latest movie and upcoming release of the final book in the next few days.

That being said, there's some interesting material in TLG's 'Path of the Magi' which showcases a school of magic.

Moriarty the Red

I know...

That's actually part of the reason this idea sprang up.
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Don't forget Snape told Harry that truly skilled wizards don't need to say anything. The last book I believe. Maybe book 5.
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Nelzie wrote:
No, no and no. I despise the setting of Ars Magica with a passion. To me, it is a hateful, hurtful setting that I would rather never visit.

Ouch... sorry to have struck a nerve there...
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jamesmishler wrote:
Ouch... sorry to have struck a nerve there...

Apology accepted. 'Ars Magica' is really the only game out there that is capable of raising my blood pressure. (I really don't want to go into the reasons here.)
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Nelzie wrote:
Hmm... maybe I shouldn't have suggested a "Harry Potter Like" world, everyone seems to be getting caught up in Harry Potterisms, which is far from my intent.

My intent is to add minor changes to the C&C Wizard and Illusionist in order to be able to run an "All Wizard" campaign without requiring a major rewrite of the rules. Just making wizards/illusionists mildly more potent and capable so they don't get slammed and destroyed like sheets of paper.

In that case, I'd start them all at 5th level or so, saying that levels 1-4 were completed in school.

Here's the next bit in what I have been working on for this concept...
Wizard's Fatigue

Using magic can be taxing on the physical body. Fatigue can cause the most powerful of Wizards to flub the simplest of spells and can certainly mean the difference between victory or defeat in a Wizard's duel. Fatigue can be acquired in a handful of different ways and the result is an increase in the Challenge Level for overcoming the physical limits of magic. One way to acquire fatigue is through attempting to bring forth spells beyond the amount that a wizard's body is capable of easily handling, still other methods include insidious spells, potions, items and curses to weaken the body.

This fatigue is 'magical' in nature and unless under the effect of wizard's spells, potions, devices, etc., a normal human cannot be affected by this type of fatigue.

Fatigue is naturally offset by any Constitution Bonus (For non-magic related actions) and when being taken into account for casting spells, the Wizard's level, Intelligence bonus and Constitution bonus is able to offset fatigue. Otherwise, accumulated fatigue is added to the challenge level of every use of the SIEGE Engine (Excepting Saving Throws) to illustrate that with fatigue a wizard weakens. Luckily, the acquisition of fatigue is rare and even fatigue that could be caused by an opponent provides an opportunity for the wizard to save against gaining fatigue points.
Obtaining Fatigue Points

A wizard can become magically fatigued through two real effects. One is by attempting to push him/herself beyond their capabilities and cast spells outside of the limits of their power and the other is through external effects, be it from opponent spell, potion or magical device. Once a wizard gains this magical fatigue, he/she will find even the most simple of tasks difficult to remain focused upon and may even lose spells that he/she would otherwise have no problem with casting.

Every wizard has a certain number of spells of a given level of power that they are able to cast everyday. When resting at night a wizard recharges this energy and as a wizard gains experience, more of this energy can be contained. Sometimes, even with increased ability to cast spells, a wizard simply doesn't have enough to do the job he/she is trying to do. When this happens, the wizard can push himself to harness additional wild magical energies and has a chance at casting another spell. However, when harnessing this more wild and untamed magic, the wizard takes on a magical fatigue.

In order to harness this wild energy and cast a spell, the wizard must make a SIEGE Engine check. This is an Intelligence check with the Challenge Level being composed of both the current amount of Fatigue Points a wizard has, as well as the Power Level of the spell. For example, Jorin has cast all the 2nd level spells he can cast in one day, but needs to cast one more. So Jorin has to make a SIEGE Engine check as follows:

Int Bonus + Lvl + d20 > TN + Fatigue Points + Spell Level

3 + 3 + d20 > 12 + 0 + 2

Which means that Jorin needs to roll 8 or higher on the d20 to be able to cast a second level spell. Whether or not he succeeds, Jorin will take 2 Fatigue Points which are based off of the power level of the spell that he wanted to cast.

Until a Wizard obtains one Fatigue Point, all SIEGE Engine Checks are made as normal. Once a FP is gained, the FPs are added to the Challenge level of all SIEGE Engine checks and also get in the way of normal spell casting of spells a wizard may otherwise be able to cast. Continuing the above example, Jorin cast his 2nd level spell and now has 2 fatigue points. He has one "free" 1st level spell that he needs to cast and attempts to do so. Normally, this would be no problem, except now Jorin is fatigued and has to make the following SIEGE Engine Check:

Int Bonus + Lvl + d20 > TN + FP

3 + 3 + d20 > 12 + 2

Jorin needs to roll higher than 6 in order to be able to cast this 1st level spell. Regardless of whether or not Jorin is successful, no additional Fatigue Points are gained. Fatigue Points are only gained through pushing past the body's limits, they don't cause themselves to cascade, unless the wizard is attempting to push him/herself further.
Removing Fatigue

The only way that a wizard can get rid of fatigue is through rest. With 8 hours of rest, the wizard can lose 1d2+CON bonus of Fatigue Points. Until all of these FPs are gone, the wizard will need to make SIEGE Engine checks to cast all 1st-level spells and up and the FPs are added to all SIEGE Engine check Challenge Levels as detailed above.

---

I need to work out the basics for a wizard to cause an opponent to be fatigued. Nothing complex, just a spell with a save or a potion/poison and or cursed magical devices that add "permanent" Fatigue Points until the curse can be lifted.

After that, a few more things related to the "Wand" spells, then the mechanical differences will be 95% ready to be used in a variety of different settings. I will also expand upon the whole "magical battery" concept.
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I have given it some thought and decided that this "All Wizard" campaign mechanics changes should include both Clerics and Druids as well. Basically creating 4 "Schools" of magic, which should be plenty to go along with keeping the concept of KISS alive and well.

All of these 'Wizards' would be limited to the same spell lists as what is listed in the PHB and all will have access to a set of "extra" spells that will fall under a "General" category of magic. I am considering opening up 0-Level spells from each "School" to be available to all the 'Wizards'. There will be a few other differences as well. All 'Wizards' will use the same XP chart or maybe two different XP charts, depending upon what "extra" stuff one school has over another, beyond that, all the Schools of 'Wizards' will be identical, same Hit Points, same BtH, same Armor/Weapon restrictions. The only real differences being the types of "main" magic that each can cast.
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I just wanted to say that this is a pretty facinating topic. I really love the ideas that are springing up which are useful to even the standard campaign with a certain wizard flre to it.

As mentioned above, Path of the Magi has some great ideas that could be incorporated into a wizard-centric setting.

I would also reccomend the 3rd edition supplement REDHURST, ACADEMY OF MAGIC by Humanhead Stuidos for a cool wizards school setting.
...........................................Omote

FPQ
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Omote wrote:
I just wanted to say that this is a pretty facinating topic. I really love the ideas that are springing up which are useful to even the standard campaign with a certain wizard flre to it.

As mentioned above, Path of the Magi has some great ideas that could be incorporated into a wizard-centric setting.

I would also reccomend the 3rd edition supplement REDHURST, ACADEMY OF MAGIC by Humanhead Stuidos for a cool wizards school setting.
...........................................Omote

FPQ

Thanks.

I am trying to make this all be rather setting agnostic and when the basic rules are in place, put down a few possible settings.

On an email list I belong to, someone suggested that this might fit a "Dresden Files" themed setting.
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