Encumbrance Affecting AC

FCWESEL · Post by **FCWESEL** » Tue Nov 06, 2007 8:30 pm

On one of the PC sheets I found for C&C, it has a increasing penalty for AC:

Light Load (-1)

Moderate Load (-2)

Heavy Load (-4)

Overburdened Load (-8)

The PHB doesn't seem to indicate this penalty. The PHB does not that DEX is lost to AC at Heavy and Overburdened. I assume the AC penalty mentioned above must be a home-rule for that sheet, but I wanted to make sure. Is there some rule outside the PHB p44-45 that I am missing?

Thanks!

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Tue Nov 06, 2007 9:37 pm

Encumbrance has been, and probably still is, an "evolving rule". The character sheets were done before the 3rd printing, so I would go with what is in the book, especially if you have the third printing.

Until the encumbrance rules guru comes by, anyways. Which he does, upon occasion.
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FCWESEL · Post by **FCWESEL** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 4:25 am

Treebore wrote:
Encumbrance has been, and probably still is, an "evolving rule". The character sheets were done before the 3rd printing, so I would go with what is in the book, especially if you have the third printing.

Is there some place on my book that says what print run it is?

moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 5:01 am

It would seem to me that the character sheet you saw had some house rules implemented with it.

In the 2nd and 3rd (which is the latest) printing of the PHB, the effects of encumbrance have remained the same.

To see which printing you have, all you have to do is look at the spine of the book at the product code.

TLG80102 is the second printing

TLG80103 is the third printing

I believe that TLG8010 is code for the original printing.

With regards to official Encumbrance rules and AC, only at Heavy and Overburdened do characters lose all their Dexterity Bonus to AC. Other effects exists as well and these can be found on page 45 of the PHB.

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moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 5:14 am

Treebore wrote:
Encumbrance has been, and probably still is, an "evolving rule". The character sheets were done before the 3rd printing, so I would go with what is in the book, especially if you have the third printing.

Until the encumbrance rules guru comes by, anyways. Which he does, upon occasion.

The only significant changes to encumbrance are stickied but these weren't implemented in the 3rd printing! These were only to do with objects with carrying capacities anway.

M
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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 5:34 am

Hence my advice to go by the book.
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moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 5:45 am

Treebore wrote:
Hence my advice to go by the book.

Well... ya... and you absolutely correct in doing so!

M
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FCWESEL · Post by **FCWESEL** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 6:23 am

Awesome. Thanks guys. I got the third printing.

Cool, thanks for clearing that up, I am trying to do my own PC sheets, so I wanted to make sure I got that rules part down right on the sheet.

Thanks again.

CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 9:28 am

I believe that might be Mad Irishman's 'New C&C Record Sheet".
http://www.mad-irishman.net/pub_candc.html

It is labeled as "beta" so I guess it is still a work in progress.

Looks nice enough ...
(I still use them because it gives more space to write down class abilities).
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FCWESEL · Post by **FCWESEL** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 2:36 pm

CharlieRock wrote:
I believe that might be Mad Irishman's 'New C&C Record Sheet".

Yes, that's the one. Thanks, me brain pan just wasn't working when I originally posted. Seems almost SOP these days, sadly.

I'm one of those freaks that always has to create his own character sheets. Thank god computers and WORD came along, as I used to do them with type-writers...I'm surprised I still have hair after those days.

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 7:19 pm

A great many people think the penalties are too steep or the ER is too low. I think the way the book works is just fine (2nd and 3rd printings).

-O
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BASH MAN · Post by **BASH MAN** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 8:19 pm

At a certain point wouldn't a lot of encumberance help your AC? Provide cover, etc. Like you are under a small hill of stuff-- when you get attacked it is harder to hit you because all the stuff gets in the way-- like a tortoise and his shell...
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CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 8:32 pm

I emailed MI productions about that. We'll see when he gets around to it.

I still use them. I like their spacing and layout better then the book ones. There is more space for class abilities notes. And they are the only ones Mrs Charlie will use.
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CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Wed Nov 07, 2007 8:35 pm

BASH MAN wrote:
At a certain point wouldn't a lot of encumberance help your AC? Provide cover, etc. Like you are under a small hill of stuff-- when you get attacked it is harder to hit you because all the stuff gets in the way-- like a tortoise and his shell...

Edit: I just got an e-mail back from the Mad Irishman. He is going to be taking a look at the sheet in question.
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cheeplives · Post by **cheeplives** » Thu Nov 08, 2007 2:33 pm

AC penalties due to Encumbrance were in the 1st Printing of C&C and were an editorial mistake (a hold-over from a previous ENC system). They were removed for the 2nd and 3rd printing. ENC now only affects Dexterity Checks, Movement Rate, and will deny any Dex Bonus to AC at the higher levels.

You could, if you wanted to, change all those - signs to + signs and they would equate to the Dexterity Check Challenge Level penalty for each of the ENC levels except for Overburdened, which is technically an 'auto fail'...

CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Thu Nov 08, 2007 3:47 pm

cheeplives wrote:
You could, if you wanted to, change all those - signs to + signs and they would equate to the Dexterity Check Challenge Level penalty for each of the ENC levels except for Overburdened, which is technically an 'auto fail'...

Good idea!
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FCWESEL · Post by **FCWESEL** » Thu Nov 08, 2007 10:32 pm

Cool. Thanks to everyone for their help.

CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 11:14 pm

The character sheet in question is now updated with the newest encumburance rules.
http://www.mad-irishman.net/pub_candc.html

Not only that, it has the Dex modifiers for CLs and move multipliers.

Pretty gnarly.
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Alcahaelas · Post by **Alcahaelas** » Tue Nov 13, 2007 11:35 pm

Very nice. Thanks!
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Omote · Post by **Omote** » Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:05 am

Thanks CharlieRock. I think I like that sheet MI came up with best... next to my own of course.
-O
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