Order of the Phoenix

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 10:57 pm

Edit: Since this is now up for publication I now claim copyright on this. I still give permission for private use in personal games, though. Just no reposting to other message boards, or other forms of public sharing.

An order for Knights. I think I could use a good bit of help on this one. IF any of you are familiar with medievel armor making, and real times for manufacture, etc... I would greatly appreciate your sagely knowledge.

Plus I am sure there are other beneifts that would be available, but my imagination/creativity is tapped out right now.

Title name suggestions, and what ranks would they be earned at, would be greatly appreciated. 3rd, 5th, 8th, and 10th level are obvious name levels in my opinion.

Order of the Phoenix

An order for Knightly warriors.

You join the Order via sponsorhship or invitation and approval of the council. Edit: OR are born into it.

EDIT:

Titles:

First level: Knight of Ash

3rd level: Knight of Fire

5th Level: Knight of the Blue Flame

8th Level: Knight of the White Flame

10th Level: Knight of the Invisible Flame

Knights in charge of Chapter Houses: Captain of the Vigilant Flame of "City name"

Overall Commander of Chapter houses in a given Kingdom/City State/etc...: Fire Lord of "insert name"

Overall leader of the Order of the Phoenix: The Eternal Flame

Privledges of the Knights:

As is common of most Knightly orders each Chapter House or Landed Knight of the order will always provide housing and food for up to a month, both for the Knight and his mount. Edit: To stay longer the Knight must perform some type of helpful service, daily, to the order. Either working as an apprentice in the Smithy, training mounts, etc...

The Chapter Houses, and homes of richer landed members, offer libraries from which to research and learn Coats of Arms and Heraldry of many lands, especially those in which members of the Order live. There is also a list of Chapter Houses and landed members homes, so that a Knight can plan out ahead a time his itinerary, as well as send messages ahead as courteous "warnings" that a guest is coming.

These libraries also contain treatise' on engineering, armor and weapon making, leadership, tactics, even how to combat magic on the battlefield, etc...

Edit: Spending a month studying any one topic in these libraries can allow the character to have that Knowledge skill. CK call, as usual. Crafting can be learned to, but will require more time, and actually constructing items under a Master. Refer to armor and weapon crafting below for a basic guideline.

Other benefits, every Chapter House and home of a Landed noble has, its own Blacksmithing Shop, allowing for crafting of weapons and armor for the Knight and his mount. This allows Knights of the Order to make themselves armor and weapons, if they know how, for half of the listed book price, including, if they are skilled enough to do so, expertly made items. The expert portion will only double the price, but the length of time will be the same, which is one additonal week for each plus to be put on a weapon (+1 to hit and damage would be two extra weeks). For Expert Armor it will require and extra month of crafting, Crafting Full Plate armor typically takes 3 months of dedicated time, so expert would require 4 months. Plate Mail takes a month, so expert would take two months. Full Chain takes 6 weeks when done by one laborer, two laborers would cut it to 3 weeks, 3 laborers to two weeks. Expert would add a month, period, due to the meticulous care and attention to detail needed for EVERY link of chain. In fact, if it is done by only one laborer Expert chain will take 3 months. Similiar for a Chain Shirt, but its base is time is two weeks.

In fact all times assume one highly skilled person doing all labor, times can be adjusted due to additionally highly skilled craftsmen or Journey Man Apprentices.

IF a Knight does not have the ability, or the time, to make their own weapons and armor, they may buy it from the Chapter houses at 20% off typical base prices, then use the Expert multiplier when purchasing expert items.

Enameling or etching coats of arms, holy symbols, and other designs can up the price considerably, up to tripling its base cost. Use of silver and gold plating or inlay will increase things even more. Setting of gemstones will increase prices even more.

Most Knights of the Order of the Phoenix who were born to the order, meaning their mother or father was/is a member of the Order, would have been trained/apprenticed in these smithies learning to do many of these smithing processes and techniques. General knowledge will have been taught to them by the time they were 16. Most Knights are Knighted and indoctrinated as full members of the order at age 18, when born to the order.

Knights who never learned to do this work can apprentice themselves at any time to learn them. However it will take a 3 year intensive course to learn everything. 1 year to learn all armors, 1 year to learn all knightly weapons, and one year to learn enameling, gem setting, etching, and inlay.

To be able to do expert and high quality artisan work a Knight must hav WIS as a Prime. Otherwise they are only capable of highly serviceable and "nice" looking work. No expert quality, or high end art work (meaning in lay, enameling, etching, etc...)

Also realize that true masters of expert work also make their own steel, and their own molds with which to caste the steel, which is a large part of why it takes so much longer. To make truly expert weapons and armor you have to know how well they were caste in the first place.

The order often has business "partnerships", in particular with high end clothes makers, jewelers, goldsmiths, silversmiths, saddle makers, etc... Typically these partnerships allow Order members to get 10 to 30% discounts off of items and custom made work. Other partnerhsips with other businesses may also exist, but you must inquire with the local Chapter House to find out what, or look for businesses displaying the Order of the Phoenix's Coat of Arms.

The biggest benefit to a Knight of the Order is when they do a Call to Arms. Their call is always responded to as fast as possible. This means that 20 will answer the call every month, even more if the gods are with you (IE the CK allows it).

Another benefit of the order, which can be a huge one, is for politically active Knights. Members will always back each other, even across national boundaries, as long as they are not to counter purposes of the political activities of other members. Even when they are up to plans counter to one another they will work out how to minimize the effects between them.

Expected behaviour of Knights:

They will fulfill the Virtues and Code of Conduct as laid out in the PH. With stronger emphasis on Honor, Largesse, and Loyalty. A knight still would never want to be found out to have done anything counter to any of the codes. Expulsion is almost assured in such cases. Atonemnet and being reinstituted into the order are theoretically possible, but has never been done.
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Alcahaelas · Post by **Alcahaelas** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:21 pm

I don't see anything about Aurors and Dementors in there.
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Geron Raveneye · Post by **Geron Raveneye** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:22 pm

Now just don't try to tell us you never heard of Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix.
Kidding, obviously.
Wish I could help you with manufacturing times, but I can add my interest to reliable sources for that information to yours, maybe it helps.

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:40 pm

The Order of the Phoenix has been around as a name for many centuries before HArry Potter came along.

Heck, the name has been in use by me for almost my whole RPG hobby career, which is over 23 years now.

I should make a up a Phoenix creature like the one in Harry Potter, and have it provide healing to members fo the Order.

Hmmm. That definitely has a strong "cool" factor to it.
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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:56 pm

BTW, as far as Sagely Knowledge goes, my wife and I have done enameling, jewelry casting/making, gem cutting, cabbing, and setting for real, as a business. My wife did most of the jewlwery making and I did all the gem cutting, cabbing, and setting. Plus the buying and selling.

We quit in 2003 when the Army ruined my wifes health, but we still have the knowledge and know how.
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Alcahaelas · Post by **Alcahaelas** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:43 am

Ever crafted a wand?
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gideon_thorne wrote:
There are lots of explanations that a clever CK can use to bullshit any roll.

Lurker · Post by **Lurker** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:51 am

Great write up!
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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:52 am

Alcahaelas wrote:
Ever crafted a wand?

Non magical? Yes.
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Alcahaelas · Post by **Alcahaelas** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:56 am

Treebore wrote:
Non magical? Yes.

Unicorn hair or phoenix feather?
_________________
I am not a hamster and Life is not a wheel.

gideon_thorne wrote:
There are lots of explanations that a clever CK can use to bullshit any roll.

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 12:59 am

Alcahaelas wrote:
Unicorn hair or phoenix feather?

Neither. Qurtz and Topaz crystals for a new age practitioner. $600.00
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serleran · Post by **serleran** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 3:38 am

Mock what you would like, but remember this: for each thing you find humrous or "stupid," there are just as many the other side sees about you. Something Biblical about that, I hear... something about splinters and non-judgment. I forget though, as that whole chapter is full of jokes.

Alcahaelas · Post by **Alcahaelas** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:12 pm

serleran wrote:
Mock what you would like, but remember this: for each thing you find humrous or "stupid," there are just as many the other side sees about you. Something Biblical about that, I hear... something about splinters and non-judgment. I forget though, as that whole chapter is full of jokes.

I assumed, from Treebore's other posts, that he has a sense of humor. I just be joking around, no insult/offense intended.
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I am not a hamster and Life is not a wheel.

gideon_thorne wrote:
There are lots of explanations that a clever CK can use to bullshit any roll.

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:20 pm

Order of the Phoenix... sorry I thought another HP thread had popped up too. I'm sorry. Nice write up though. No fault in that.

-O
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Lurker · Post by **Lurker** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:08 am

Quote:
Neither. Qurtz and Topaz crystals for a new age practitioner. $600.00

Man I'm in the wrong job!!!! To bad my brother got all the artistic skills in the family....
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Forgive all spelling errors.

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Tadhg · Post by **Tadhg** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:37 am

The wand of Count Rhuveinus was crafted from the wing feathers of the Dodo bird. Beware it's power!
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Tadhg · Post by **Tadhg** » Thu Nov 22, 2007 12:41 am

Treebore wrote:
Order of the Phoenix

An order for Knightly warriors.

This is a great write-up, Treebore. I can definitely use it in my campaign world.

Well done.
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"Enjoy a 'world' where the fantastic is fact and magic really works!" ~ Gary Gygax

"By the pricking of my thumbs, Something wicked this way comes:" - Macbeth

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 10:37 pm

*bump*
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Go0gleplex · Post by **Go0gleplex** » Thu Jul 03, 2008 12:28 am

What type of armor Tree? Using pre-made wire and having full days to work, a chain shirt or coat takes an average of 3-5 months.

Plate armor, basic type set takes 5-8 months. Adding in fluting, scrollwork, and edging can add significant time.

(a good friend of mine did armor and weapons for a living...he used 304 stainless on the armor. I vividly remember one set of gauntlets...175 individual pieces of metal cut, hammered, and polished by hand. Though some modern tools were used, such as a grinding wheel and plasma cutter.)
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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Thu Jul 03, 2008 12:42 am

Go0gleplex wrote:
What type of armor Tree? Using pre-made wire and having full days to work, a chain shirt or coat takes an average of 3-5 months.

Plate armor, basic type set takes 5-8 months. Adding in fluting, scrollwork, and edging can add significant time.

(a good friend of mine did armor and weapons for a living...he used 304 stainless on the armor. I vividly remember one set of gauntlets...175 individual pieces of metal cut, hammered, and polished by hand. Though some modern tools were used, such as a grinding wheel and plasma cutter.)

I went by times I got from Robert Adams. Besides, old chain mail isn't made with wire, but actual rings, which they twisted while still hot/formable. Plus my estimates assumes one master and two apprentices, and why I say "CK call" because time can be highly variable based on number of workers, their skill level, and tools.

I can make good guesses on fluting, scroll work, etc... since my wife and I have used the same techniques on various pieces of jewelry. In some ways doing such work on big pieces, like armor, would be easier and faster.
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Go0gleplex · Post by **Go0gleplex** » Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:58 am

It seemed to be a bit faster Tree. They used what looked to be an old shot put on the end of a stick and pounded the metal plates into shape atop a round of wood, not an anvil...a bit at a time.

Yup...know about chainmail. Was SCA for a time...and the technique for chain actually varied by region and by time period.
The guy I knew who made the plate, Sven, had several featured on TV by the evangelist who commissioned them. (Three sets, 5k for the cheapest and 15k for the fancy fancy one...in 1982 dollars)

I think one of the funnest events I participated in was a mob melee against one of the costume/sparring partners for the first season of Highlander the series. 10 of us attacked (with boffer weapons)...he dropped two in less than 10 seconds and kept the rest of us from landing even a single meaningful blow....he LET us run away.
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The obvious will always trip you up FAR more than the obscure.

Baron Grignak Hammerhand of the Pacifica Provinces-

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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Thu Jul 03, 2008 2:23 am

Go0gleplex wrote:
It seemed to be a bit faster Tree. They used what looked to be an old shot put on the end of a stick and pounded the metal plates into shape atop a round of wood, not an anvil...a bit at a time.

Yup...know about chainmail. Was SCA for a time...and the technique for chain actually varied by region and by time period.
The guy I knew who made the plate, Sven, had several featured on TV by the evangelist who commissioned them. (Three sets, 5k for the cheapest and 15k for the fancy fancy one...in 1982 dollars)

I think one of the funnest events I participated in was a mob melee against one of the costume/sparring partners for the first season of Highlander the series. 10 of us attacked (with boffer weapons)...he dropped two in less than 10 seconds and kept the rest of us from landing even a single meaningful blow....he LET us run away.

Yeah, the only visuals I saw were on History Channel programs, all I remember is it backed up what Robert Adams wrote (the guy who authored the Horse Clan series) before he died. He did some awesome black smithing work in his life time, some of which I got to actually put my hands on in Charleston, SC. He did a couple of gates for courtyards in a couple of rich houses in downtown (old town) Charleston.
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