Question re: Wraiths

[nwelte1]

Since the wraith's description states they can attack through solid objects, does this mean that they can ignore regular armor, natural armor, and shields as per 3.5?

[anonymous]

No, because AC isn't broken down into categories as it is in 3rd edition D&D.

[voynich]

seeing as the player should very well know what ac bonus is being provided by his armor, a wraith should be able to bypass it. also, it is not difficult to determine what bonus, if any, a monster is getting from "armor" assuming they have armor. most that use it tend to mention the type involved and ac starts at 10. so, yes, a wraith ignores nonmagical armor, and against magical stuff, only the plus applies. but, that is only how i do it. i think not ruling that way makes the threat reduced too much to be effective.
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[DangerDwarf]

Tenser's Floating Disk wrote:
No, because AC isn't broken down into categories as it is in 3rd edition D&D.

Not entirely true. Off the top of my head, I know the spell Acid Arrow requires a ranged touch attack to hit. So, while not specifically addressing a "Touch AC" the game does assume its existence.

[Omote]

I definitely make a wriath's attack as touch attack. This makes the wriath an even more devestating opponent.

-O
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[bighara]

See p. 117 of the PHB (3rd Print)

Basically touch attack assumes AC 10, along with any special mods (concealment, etc.), magical protection, and/or DEX.

[Lord Dynel]

bighara wrote:
See p. 117 of the PHB (3rd Print)

Basically touch attack assumes AC 10, along with any special mods (concealment, etc.), magical protection, and/or DEX.

Which is pretty much the same as 3.x, if I'm recalling correctly.

[anonymous]

A wraith attack isn't described as a touch attack. The entry says the Wraith can walk through objects in order to surprise but not that its attack passes through armour. If you attack a goblin in 3E D&D (not in any previous editions) you know how much of its AC is down to its size, its dexterity, its hide and the armour is wears (which itself is then broken down into normal armour value and magical bonus) so you can have an armour bypassing attack. In C&C, this is not the case.

[Omote]

Well, you could break AC down to different types of bonuses in C&C. It's not really that hard. Matter of fact, the way I accomplish this is via the RAW rules of the C&C PHB regarding touch attack.

Magical rings add to the touch attack AC, and pluses to magical armor, shields, etc (not the standard bonus that nonmagical armor provides). add to touch attack AC.

-O
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[DangerDwarf]

Tenser's Floating Disk wrote:
so you can have an armour bypassing attack. In C&C, this is not the case.

Yes you can, the spell Acid Arrow is an example of it and as Bighara so kindly pointed out, it is even directly addressed in the PHB.

[gideon_thorne]

CK call. Personally, I'd have the critters ignore the armor. Wraith's are supposed to be a deadly otherworldly threat after all. Keeps the players on their toes.
Course, there is the flip side. Perhaps spectral entities are affected by the conductivity of forged metals like certain beings are in folklore.

There is a logic either way. It all depends on what sort of game your running.
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Peter Bradley

[DangerDwarf]

Yes, for the original question. I think it is the CK's call. If you choose to let them bypass it, C&C does have the rules for that in place.

I personally allow the attacks to bypass armor. I do however, give PC's opportunities to thwart the wraiths in that regard. Anointing your armor with holy water prior to battle makes the armor effective against the wraiths. There are a few other tricks a PC can use as well.

[Valerian]

I just give incorporeal monsters a x2 HD bonus to hit to represent speed, and incorporability . Simple rule seems to work. Beware spectres at +14 . I also give a CON save vs. level loss.
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[anonymous]

You enter the Chamber of Infinite Orcs...

[serleran]

The intent of the description (when I was still writing out what "incorporeal" meant, that being discarded as unnecessary), was to make the attack as a "touch," granting only magical and Dexterity-based AC modifiers. Wraiths, and all things like them, are beings of great fear.

[anonymous]

Is this one for the errata then? Wraiths should make touch attacks like Spectres?

[Treebore]

Tenser's Floating Disk wrote:
Is this one for the errata then? Wraiths should make touch attacks like Spectres?

I think so. I should at least add it to my House Rules document so I remember that is how it was intended to be.
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