Troll Lord Games

Hello all.

For your delectation I submit my hastily cobbled together C&C houserules. The idea is to extend the grittier feel of low level play whilst maintaining a respectable level of competence. I've dubbed this the Elastic Aragorn Effect, comparing his abilities and improvement over the course of the movie trilogy with how I wanted PCs to measure up within the game world. It's written for the kind of fantasy where trolls are encountered individually and hunting down a giant could conceivably form the basis of a mini-campaign. It's bloody and brutal, but includes safeguards ensuring that the traditional amounts of mayhem can still be inflicted on humanoids and the like.

Anyway, on with the show! Let me know what you think...
THE BTH BONUS: This remain the same for each class, but I thought I'd flag it since some of the changes are keyed off it's progression.
PLAYER CHARACTER / NPC HIT POINTS: A character or classed NPCs HPs are equal to (Max Hit Die Result) + (1/2 x Con) + (BTH).

Thus a 3rd level wizard with 12 Con would have : (4) + (6) + (1) = 11 HP

A 10th level fighter with 14 Con would have: (10) + (7) +(10) = 27 HP
MONSTER HPs = Large monsters HPs are equal to their rolled maximum. So an Ogre with 4 (d8) HD would have 32 HPs.

Medium sized and smaller are equal to the (Max of 1st Hit Die) + (2 x Additional Hit Dice)

Thus a 8 (d8) HD Orcish Chief would have (8) + (14) = 22 HPs
DEFENSE = AC is replaced with two defensive scores, Parry and Dodge. Armour no longer contributes to these totals, instead offering damage reduction described below.
Parry = 10 + the adjusted attack bonus for the weapon in use, including BTH, Str modifier, weapon mastery, magical bonus etc
Dodge = 10 + BTH + Dex bonus + any relevant miscellaneous bonus - Half armour Damage Reduction (See below)
MONSTER DEFENSE = 10 + HD. Adjust up and down on a one-for-one basis with armour (See below)
DAMAGE = Damage is no longer rolled. Everyone (including monsters and NPCs) does maximum damage on a hit, including all bonuses.

On a natural '20' a critical is scored, resulting in 1.5 x max damage.
SPELL DAMAGE = Spells that increase in damage by caster level now inflict (Max result of first die) + (2 x additional dice) in damage.

Thus a 10th level fireball would inflict (6) + (18) = 24 HP damage. Armour reduces this as described below.
ARMOUR = Armour offers damage reduction, equal to it's former AC bonus, e.g chainmail has DR 5.

Every hit scored does a minimum of 1 HP damage, even if the armour worn by the defender would reduce it's damage total to zero.
MONSTER ARMOUR = Use HD as DR to reflect tough skin, superior armour and the like. I suggest limiting the maximum DR at 8, though. Adjust on a one-for-one basis with Parry and Dodge scores (see above).

That's the basics taken care of. Next up I'll list a couple of the adjusted class benefits that help extend PC survivability. Everyone gets Combat Dominance! Seriously!

FIGHTER COMBAT DOMINANCE = A skilled fighter can attack many opponents per round, up to his BTH in Hit Dice.

Thus a 6th level fighter (BTH 6) could make one attack against a 6 HD monster, one attack each against a against a pair of 3 HD monsters, or any combination that adds up to 6HD (including six attacks against a mob of 1HD monsters!) The only limit is that no more than two attacks can be made against any individual creature in a round. So a 10th level fighter with 10 HD of attacks could still only attack the same 1HD Orc twice that round.
GENERAL COMBAT DOMINANCE = All classes have access to the Combat Dominance ability, but their HD total per round is HALF their BTH bonus, rounded down.

Andrew DS wrote:
FIGHTER COMBAT DOMINANCE = A skilled fighter can attack many opponents per round, up to his BTH in Hit Dice.

Thus a 6th level fighter (BTH 6) could make one attack against a 6 HD monster, one attack each against a against a pair of 3 HD monsters, or any combination that adds up to 6HD (including six attacks against a mob of 1HD monsters!) The only limit is that no more than two attacks can be made against any individual creature in a round. So a 10th level fighter with 10 HD of attacks could still only attack the same 1HD Orc twice that round.
GENERAL COMBAT DOMINANCE = All classes have access to thE Combat Dominance ability, but their HD total per round is HALF their BTH bonus, rounded down.

I really dig the Combat Dominance tweak and, for low-power games, your ideas on generating hit points.

I'd suggest starting hit points off a bit higher by just using the character's full CON score:

MAX HIT POINTS at 1st LEVEL+ CON SCORE + BTH BONUS

Using your example:

A 3rd level wizard with 12 Con would have : (4) + (12) + (1) = 17 HP

A 10th level fighter with 14 Con would have: (10) + (14) +(10) = 34 HP

The difference isn't huge but is just enough to allow PCs to survive an extra shot at low levels.

Quote:
SPELL DAMAGE = Spells that increase in damage by caster level now inflict (Max result of first die) + (2 x additional dice) in damage.

Thus a 10th level fireball would inflict (6) + (18) = 24 HP damage. Armour reduces this as described below.

How do saves work? Without a reference, this rule obliterates the non-fighters.
_________________
If it matters, leave a message at the beep.
Serl's Corner

csperkins1970 wrote:
I really dig the Combat Dominance tweak and, for low-power games, your ideas on generating hit points.

Thanks!

I scribbled these down after buying a stack of 70s and 80s TSR modules over the weekend. Looking through them I was struck by how much I enjoyed lower-level play over the more powerful stuff. Hommlett. Saltmarsh. The Keep. These were the adventures I loved best, mainly because of the feeling of sustained peril they generated. A 3rd level fighter exploring the Lost City needed to be a craftier, cleverer beast than his 10th level counterpart at The Temple of Death, despite both modules being appropriate challenges for their abilities. I wanted something that maintained that sense of nearby danger.

Quote:
I'd suggest starting hit points off a bit higher by just using the character's full CON score:

MAX HIT POINTS at 1st LEVEL+ CON SCORE + BTH BONUS

Using your example:

A 3rd level wizard with 12 Con would have : (4) + (12) + (1) = 17 HP

A 10th level fighter with 14 Con would have: (10) + (14) +(10) = 34 HP

The difference isn't huge but is just enough to allow PCs to survive an extra shot at low levels.

Thanks for the input. Adding full Con to starting HP was my first instinct, and I may well return to it in light of the potential flaw pointed out above.

serleran wrote:
How do saves work? Without a reference, this rule obliterates the non-fighters.

Good point. I forgot to mention that all classes get access to at least some armour:
Wizards/Illusionists/Monks = Any armour up to DR 2
Thieves/Assassins/Bards/Druids = Any armour up to DR 4
Barbarians/Rangers = DR 5


Fighter/Paladins/Knights/Clerics = Any armour
This is a provisional list and subject to change

But even with armour protection your point stilll stands. I don't want to muck about with saving throws, they're fine as is.

Possible soloutions include:

- Increasing HP totals by adding the PCs full Con score

- Introducing a direct spell damage resistance score (equivalent to 1 DR per level vs. direct damage spells)

- Something else. Suggestions welcome!

Interesting propositions. Probably the most inviting prospect is the one that seems to be the simplest: Monsters have max HP. The idea of dealing max damage is also interesting. It reminds me more of a "video-game" rpg, though not necessarily in a bad way. Things to ponder indeed.
_________________
Scientists will never understand that the world doesn't have to adhere to laws. A world where Firefly gets cancelled and Nip/Tuck thrives clearly obeys powers not known to us.

Heavy_Crossbow wrote:
Interesting propositions. Probably the most inviting prospect is the one that seems to be the simplest: Monsters have max HP. The idea of dealing max damage is also interesting. It reminds me more of a "video-game" rpg, though not necessarily in a bad way. Things to ponder indeed.

Thanks. It was only recently that I realised that I had no preference for variable over fixed damage, and was purely doing things that way out of habit. For me the real excitement is contained in the hit roll, as it represents the contact point between PCs and the creatures they're trying to hurt. I often consider random damage a greater cause of whiff-induced disappointment than any other roll, made all the worse for it's uncanny knack of obliteratiing successful attack die results at the most inappropriate times. I'd rather close the book on the subject and say that if you're hit with a longsword swung by someone who means business then you'll be hurt to the tune of eight hit points plus bonuses.

Doing this effectively halves monsters HPs, which is why they're maximised too.

Addendum: I'm altering the size restriction. Some supernaturally tough medium-sized creatures will have their full hit dice worth of hit points.
_________________
Lareth ain't beautiful no more.

I'd also like to add that I'll be test-driving my changes with DCC #28: Into The Wilds - I'm a big fan of Harley Stroh's work, his adventures evoke the kind of atmosphere that my houserules are designed to support.
_________________
Lareth ain't beautiful no more.

What would be interested in this more "big-monster slaying" oriented rules set of yours would be to include some rules for siege weapons, such as catapults, trebuchetes, and ballistas. I know that I have a DnD 3.0 sourcebook somewhere around here that had some pretty brutal rules for siege weaponry, but without "skills", it could be difficult.
_________________
Scientists will never understand that the world doesn't have to adhere to laws. A world where Firefly gets cancelled and Nip/Tuck thrives clearly obeys powers not known to us.

I'm still on the fence regarding the hit point question, the total will either include all or half the PCs Con score. Damage reduction may also change, but I like the elegance of a system based on the current modifiers.

I have a couple of other ideas I'm toying with, but my aim is to ensure that all new rules will fit on to an A4 sheet when typed in a reasonably sized font. Trying to keep it simple!
_________________
Lareth ain't beautiful no more.

Heavy_Crossbow wrote:
What would be interested in this more "big-monster slaying" oriented rules set of yours would be to include some rules for siege weapons, such as catapults, trebuchetes, and ballistas. I know that I have a DnD 3.0 sourcebook somewhere around here that had some pretty brutal rules for siege weaponry, but without "skills", it could be difficult.

Interesting. Large monsters are far more threatening in this version of the system, so siege weaponary may be the only way to for humanity to stand against them. Of course catapults, ballista and so on will ALSO do their max damage, and anything with more than a couple of dice in it's damage output becomes an unholy terror with these rules...

It's odd you should bring this topic up - one of my thematic inspirations for the changes was UK4: The Gauntlet, which climaxes with a besieging force led by a Fire Giant hurling boulders at the fortress where the players are ensconced!
_________________
Lareth ain't beautiful no more.

Also, I was wondering if there were any good rules out there for building structure damage. Like when a catapult's missile hits a castle's wall, how much more punishment can that wall take? C&C doesn't seem to have many rules for the former part of its namesake, and I would sure like to see some. How long does it take for that giant to get through the wall? How much dragon's breath can a stone tower handle?
_________________
Scientists will never understand that the world doesn't have to adhere to laws. A world where Firefly gets cancelled and Nip/Tuck thrives clearly obeys powers not known to us.

Ok, here's an alternative version that resolves some problems I discovered:
HIT POINTS

Total HPs = 10 + First Hit Die Maximum + Con Bonus + BTH

Under this system a 3rd level Wizard with 12 Con has 10 + 4 + 0 + 1 = 15 HP

A 10th level fighter with 14 Con has 10 + 10 + 1 + 10 = 31

Monster HPs remain maximised
AC, DEFENSE & DR

Parry and Dodge Defence Values have been scrapped. We return to using AC as described in the core. For monsters use their published ACs as normal.

Armour also grants damage reduction equal to half it's AC bonus, rounded down. Thus a chain mail hauberk offers AC +5, DR 2. Monster DR is usually (AC - 10)/2, or eyeballed as best fits.

I may also allow a BTH/2 bonus to AC for classed characters.


DAMAGE

All damage remains maximised, as does healing.

Spell damage remains equals the maximum result of the first die plus 2 HP per caster level.

Arcane spellcasters have a new class ability, Aegis, which reduces direct damage totals from spells by half, with a successful save resulting in zero damage.
COMBAT DOMINANCE

Remains the same, although I may limit the maximum number of attacks per round against multiple oponents. How does five sound?
_________________
Lareth ain't beautiful no more.