Size Armor Class Adjustments???

Joe · Post by **Joe** » Thu Dec 25, 2008 7:13 am

Hi,

I can't find anything in C&C about size classes making it easier to hit.

Matter of fact, when I look thru "that other game system" I can't find one either.

Table 8.1 gives modifiers but it does not say whether it is to hit, or applied to AC.

Does C&C have any size modifiers?
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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Thu Dec 25, 2008 9:27 am

No.
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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Thu Dec 25, 2008 9:28 am

Frakkin double post.
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bighara · Post by **bighara** » Thu Dec 25, 2008 12:41 pm

iirc, in 3.X size adjustments apply to AC. No idea how it's handled in 4e.

IMO, size adjustments are an unnecessary complication for C&C. You only have SML and Large can cover a lot of territory: From a horse to a purple worm. I think the ACs listed in M&T reflects this; it's just not "itemized." The purple worm has an AC of 19; tough, but hardly unhittable. This reflects that its hide is thick and difficult to penetrate, but trying to connect is like swinging at the proverbial broad side of a barn. Conversely, a stirge has AC 16. Almost anything that connects will hurt it, but it's buzzing around like a vampiric hummingbird. Then you have things like dragons; fast and tough. That's when you start approaching AC 30+.

A little CK judgment using M&T as a guide works fine, IMO.

Maliki · Post by **Maliki** » Thu Dec 25, 2008 5:13 pm

I agree I didn't mind the rule in 3E, but I don't see it as something that C&C needs. The less rules the better.
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Julian Grimm · Post by **Julian Grimm** » Fri Dec 26, 2008 6:06 am

I'm content with there not being one. One less calculation is always best.
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Lord Dynel · Post by **Lord Dynel** » Fri Dec 26, 2008 9:15 pm

There are size modifiers for d20, but I never thought much about them - mainly because they were already integrated in the creatures' ACs without too much thought being involved. As far as C&C having them, I don't personally consider it necessary.

Go0gleplex · Post by **Go0gleplex** » Fri Dec 26, 2008 9:55 pm

That was one thing of many that was just non-sequitor with 3.X. AC is a cumulation of size, armor penetration chance, reflexes (dex), and simple 'how good can I really parry'.

So a halfling is smaller and harder to hit...the armor is either lighter/thinner to scale and easier to puncture or its slowing the lil bugger down enough to negate the size issue. (as one way of looking at it.)

A giant is larger and easier to hit (broadside of a barn reference here) but their armor is correspondingly thicker and harder to penetrate mitigating the size issue.

Frankly...why bother? Doing so is like much of 3.X and 4.X was anymore...rules lawyering/layering to wring out every advantage possible. Or a rules for rules sake. blech.
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Julian Grimm · Post by **Julian Grimm** » Sat Dec 27, 2008 2:48 am

Lord Dynel wrote:
There are size modifiers for d20, but I never thought much about them - mainly because they were already integrated in the creatures' ACs without too much thought being involved. As far as C&C having them, I don't personally consider it necessary.

True dat. It was pretty much ignorable until you were building your own monsters or NPC's. Of course this was it's own nightmare in 3.X which IMNSHO the system discouraged homebrewed items like that.
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gideon_thorne · Post by **gideon_thorne** » Sat Dec 27, 2008 6:25 pm

You could adapt the grappling rules on page 117 if you need such a thing? There's sort of a rule that is mentioned in the book. ^_^
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phadeout · Post by **phadeout** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:33 pm

Hey folks, long time no visit...

Well, on this topic I've always thought that AC modifiers didn't even make as much sense as say DR (damage reduction) for huge monsters. Think about it... Using a Dagger on that Wyrm just shouldn't work - it's not even long enough! If you want something that adds realism (I use the term very lightly) then maybe having DR modifiers for each monster makes more sense than modifiers for AC.

Just a thought!
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phadeout · Post by **phadeout** » Mon Dec 29, 2008 10:34 pm

Hey folks, long time no visit...

Well, on this topic I've always thought that AC modifiers didn't even make as much sense as say DR (damage reduction) for huge monsters. Think about it... Using a Dagger on that Wyrm just shouldn't work - it's not even long enough! If you want something that adds realism (I use the term very lightly) then maybe having DR modifiers for each monster makes more sense than modifiers for AC.

Just a thought!
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serleran · Post by **serleran** » Wed Dec 31, 2008 6:34 am

Depending on how technical one wants to get, C&C does, and does not, have size adjustments. Dwarfs receive something to AC vs. giants, which can be deduced to be a size-based bonus, but it might also not be. Additionally, large creatures can receive automatic initiative in the first round of a combat which, arguably, has nothing to do with AC, but it a combat-related modifier due solely to size. Certain monsters, like the aforementioned giant, also inflict more damage with weapons and bare hand attacks due solely to size and assumed brutishness. And, lastly, monks of various sizes see a change to their movement, as do all characters, which tends toward the combat-related. Also, its unlikely a Castle Keeper will allow a small gnome to wield a large pavis, which directly affects possible total AC.

So, yeah... and no.
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Size Armor Class Adjustments???

Size Armor Class Adjustments???

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