Troll Lord Games

So I am working on a setting. In this setting there are no spells per say.

Meaning, for those who are familiar with the Belgariad, it is more like the Will & the Word.

IE; If a sorcerer wants to try something, he must summon his strength to bend the magic to his will, instead of going to a list of recipes.

Now C&C/D&D might not be able to support this, or maybe it can. I don't know and have turned to ask your advice/knowledge on this whole thing.

Anyone?
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2e had Channelling, which was essentially a spell points system, that worked perfectly for the Will and the Word concept.
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"We'll go out through the kitchen!" Tanis Half-Elven

Peter Bradley

What book is that in Peter?

And does it allow players to make up spell effects on the fly or does it simply allow them to cast any spell from the book within their range?
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AslanC wrote:
What book is that in Peter?

And does it allow players to make up spell effects on the fly or does it simply allow them to cast any spell from the book within their range?

Spells and Magic I believe it was called. It used the standard spells in the AD&D game though.

Could still work for making up spells on the fly if you don't mind players getting creative with the spell description effects.
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"We'll go out through the kitchen!" Tanis Half-Elven

Peter Bradley

That's what I am talking about, how would you go about defining and such? That's what I am looking for essentially, guidelines for that kind of magic!
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Oddly, this is one of the few things I found almost useful from d20 -- the Epic Level Handbook, more specifically, and the concept of the "spell seed."
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Serl's Corner

AslanC wrote:
That's what I am talking about, how would you go about defining and such? That's what I am looking for essentially, guidelines for that kind of magic!

Well, first you could assign each spell a value based on level as to what it costs to cast. Then you could adjust that value depending on how much the effect varies from the base spell description. Fireball to ice ball for example.
As an aside, what would be better is a system where it breaks down the magic system into a series of generic effects. Energy, transportation, transfiguration, shape shift, ect. And then assign values based on that. It would take me a fair bit to work out such a system since my mind doesn't run to detail work quickly though. Kinda working on one in my spare time.

Then you'd need some simple formula that gives a baseline amount of spell points, that can increase by level. Perhaps something that mixes the variants of constitution and intelligence since the Will and the Word took learning and endurance.

Logically, someone could attempt to create an effect like a 9th level spell, but the cost of such a spell ought to knock the character out, if not blow their mind out like a candle.

Various failure effects could be added to the mix. From the above knock out, to the effect going awry, to the character burning out their ability.

I'll chime in with some more thoughts in a while. I'm letting my mind wander so it can dredge up memories from that very entertaining book series.
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"We'll go out through the kitchen!" Tanis Half-Elven

Peter Bradley

This is how we started to approach this idea, almost 20 years ago (2nd edition, just as 3rd was hitting the shelves.. but we never got the chance to playtest it fully or go into completely spontaneous magic, we ended up moving and going separate ways before we had a chance to get that far). Also consider that it WAS 20 years ago, so i don't remember everything in detail, but I believe I have the essence of it, and that it could be used as a workable basis. Remember, this was 2nd edition and we were working off the "memorize spells before you can use them" system as a basis.

Players could opt to not memorize their full payload of spells, but take the extra time normally spent memorizing as simple meditation, attuning their bodies to magic.

You would end up with X spell levels (based on how many normal spell levels you would have access to based on regular spell memorizing rules) that could be allocated as required - all at once, or over multiple castings.

Everytime you did a casting, you rolled a saving throw vs constitution to resist the drain, with a negative modifier equal to the effective level of the spell being cast.

Fail the saving throw, you go unconscious with a 50/50 chance of the spell going off and an equal chance of either hitting the target, or doing something unexpected such as hitting a friendly, exploding in the mage's face, etc (or equivalent effects, modified as needed to fit in with the situation for those who are more into storytelling than dice rolling - my players were. We based the effects of failing on the spell level within reasonable limits. A level 1 spell might give you a nearly incapacitating migraine for 1d4 hours. a level 6 spell failing might put you in a coma for a week. level 9 failing? we never had that happen so never addressed it)

Make the save, you're ok, the game goes on.

Roll a fumble on the save and it gets nasty - from a month long migraine, to burning out magically, to explosive aneurysm
Mostly the players would base the spell effects they were after on the existing spell lists, with modifications allowed on a case by case basis, either upping or lowering the save modifier.

Oh ya. In order to imitate the Will and the Word, you're pretty well going to have to eliminate cleric and mage spell differentiation. Since the sorcerers could heal and even resurrect.
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"We'll go out through the kitchen!" Tanis Half-Elven

Peter Bradley

Yes and no. If you keep Cleric powers and miracles and Druidic powers as essentially the Force, there is no need to eliminate them. Also it is nothing to say that sorcery can't heal.

Also I am not looking to imitate the Will and the Word, just sort of homage it
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