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Wargamer66

Howdy

Post by Wargamer66 »

I used to play 1e and 2e and was flirting with getting back into role-playing.....and made the mistake of buying 3.0 when it came out. At first it looked great, feats seemed pretty cool. After messing with that for a bit, I sorta noticed the money-pit 3.5 has turned into, as well as the fairly unplayable mish-mosh of stuff the game has turned into.

Then I found C&C and am really going to start a campaign. Looks like less can definately be more...

Questions:

Regarding the Fighter class, what is the real incentive to play one? Seems like rangers can fight well and have lots of cool abilities.... I was toying with the idea of giving the Fighter 3/2 attacks at 6th lvl or something.

Is there a decent secondary skill ruleset floating out there? I was thinking of something simple that gives a bonus, but is there for flavor. Say, raised by a tailor....you might have Tailoring +1 or 2 for skill checks, and this could go up if you use the skill a lot in game.

Anyway, thanks for C&C, it just might be the game to bring me back to RPGs after 20 years!

serleran
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Post by serleran »

The fighter is the only class that gets +1 to hit every level, the only one that starts with a major bonus to hit (weapon specialization, which improves), and the only class to gain additional attacks. Compared to the ranger, a fighter should be better, overall, as the ranger's special combat maraudar should not factor into every combat (smart CKs will not keep throwing the same things at their players...)

Also, against creatures like kobolds and goblins, a fighter is just as good, if not better, than a ranger, in fact because combat dominance kicks in, giving +1 attack / level.

As for secondary skills.... probably. I don't use such things, so I don't track who has what. You can get a free pdf of Gary Gygax' additions though, if you want them.

Otherwise, welcome to the Crusade!

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gideon_thorne
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Re: Howdy

Post by gideon_thorne »

One thing to make the warrior type classes closer to AD&D that can be done. Shift the fighters combat dominance to first level and their specialization to 4th.

Then give combat dominance to all the warrior classes.

Personally, id give the fighter an extra attack at 7th and 10th level as well. Im just used to doing things a certain way and I'm not inclined to change. ^_^

I'm sure I'll get a mess of posts in reply citing mathmatical reasons why this pushes damage and dice probability all over the place. But I've heard them before. ^_~`

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Post by Maliki »

Welcome to the Crusade!

Some tend to agree with you about the fighter others think he is fine as is, I don't think allowing him to attack 3/2 at 6th level would cause a problem.
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Post by Nelzie »

I would have no problems with playing a "Vanilla" Fighter in C&C.

The class is very solid as is.
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Post by Maliki »

Nelzie wrote:
I would have no problems with playing a "Vanilla" Fighter in C&C.

The class is very solid as is.

I agree, my point to my group when this is brought up is that one on one, with everything else being equal, the fighter will beat any other warrior type character in a fight.
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Wargamer66

Post by Wargamer66 »

Well, of course its probably iffy to start tinkering before playing...

Thanks for the replies, I was fishing to figure out if my first impression was mistaken, and it might be

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gideon_thorne
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Post by gideon_thorne »

Wargamer66 wrote:
Well, of course its probably iffy to start tinkering before playing...

Thanks for the replies, I was fishing to figure out if my first impression was mistaken, and it might be

One thing thats been a truism I have noted about C&C across the board. If the classes are played to their strengths, they all work well.

But, if someone is trying to play a cleric like a thief, or a bard like a fighter, the structure falls down. In every story that has come across this board and a couple others where folks are having trouble with a given class, this theory of mine tends to hold up.

For the C&C baseline, the Fighter works well. Those of us who play to their own baseline, some tinkering certainly will be in order. ^_^
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serleran
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Post by serleran »

That is why they are called archetypes.

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Post by Tadhg »

Welcome Wargamer66!

Enjoy the game,

Rhu.
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Re: Howdy

Post by The Venomous Pao »

Welcome to the Crusade, as they like to say around here!
Wargamer66 wrote:
Is there a decent secondary skill ruleset floating out there? I was thinking of something simple that gives a bonus, but is there for flavor. Say, raised by a tailor....you might have Tailoring +1 or 2 for skill checks, and this could go up if you use the skill a lot in game.

In addition to the aforementioned Gygax skill stuff, you might also want to check out Jason Vey's Backgrounds. It sounds like what you're looking for might be better modelled by that approach. Actually, there's all kinds of neat stuff at Jason's site.

Be sure to check out Simon Washbourne's Netbook of Classes, too. There's some really great additional classes in that thing.

Game on!

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Jyrdan Fairblade
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Post by Jyrdan Fairblade »

Wilkommen! C&C is indeed such a brilliant system. And your description of 3.5 as a money pit is quite apt. I was reading an old Dragon recently, where in the preview of 3.5 it was described as 3D edition, because of the increased integration of miniatures. Which is where the money's at, judging from WotC's business practices.

Personally, I like the fighter class quite a lot. But if you wanted to add a skill set, it'd be pretty easy to port the background skills from 1e into C&C. I can't remember what they're called; not non-weapon proficiences, but the percentile table you could roll on.

Korgoth

Post by Korgoth »

Jyrdan Fairblade wrote:
Wilkommen! C&C is indeed such a brilliant system. And your description of 3.5 as a money pit is quite apt. I was reading an old Dragon recently, where in the preview of 3.5 it was described as 3D edition, because of the increased integration of miniatures. Which is where the money's at, judging from WotC's business practices.

Personally, I like the fighter class quite a lot. But if you wanted to add a skill set, it'd be pretty easy to port the background skills from 1e into C&C. I can't remember what they're called; not non-weapon proficiences, but the percentile table you could roll on.

"Secondary Skills". We used to use them sometimes in the old days and they worked fine. You just made up what your skill or background was, and that's the stuff you could do.
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