So what do you like best in the CKG?

[Treebore]

Or maybe I should say, think you like best, since most of us have yet to even get to actually use any of the rules yet.

I like a lot of the ideas in the class advancement, but I am definitely going to have to do some serious rewriting to have them work in a way acceptable to me. Some powers I think are way too weak to make them wait until such a high level to get, so will put them much earlier, others I still think should come earlier, but only by 2 to 4 levels, a few I actually like where the Trolls have them. So I have a lot of tweaking to do with these.

I don't think I am going to use the attribute modifier alternatives at all.

New races? I don't see me ever using these, I have too many other sources that I think will be easier to just adapt, but time will tell.

Now I like a lot of the ideas about spell books, components, and the like. So I have a lot of decision making to do with this material. I'm definitely going to make use of the Penance table on page 38, and not only with regards to holy symbols. I definitely love a printed material components list, which will definitely be handy, depending on which rules variant I go with. I am seriously considering imbuing the wand with components as well as the Holy Symbol, but still a lot of thinking to do.

I also like the spell purchase costs in general, because I much prefer them being affordable at low level, and much less so at higher levels, and definitely agree with the "prefer to trade spells" over selling them.

The discussion presented on Illusionists and how the Trolls "interpret" the Illusionist class is also of great interest to me, and has me much more open to allowing them to "heal" as well. Again, still more thinking and rereading for me to do here.

I have also been a fan of "Holy Ground" and am glad to see an official way to go about having them. Same for Unholy Ground, of course!

Their ideas on Holy Water, not so sure about. I like it in principal, but I think I will have to tweak it a bit to become something I want to have.

Alternative spell casting? I traditionally dislike Mana cost systems, because they typically make such classes that are already powerful even more so. This one is no different, a mage with an 18 INT can already cast 4 first level spells? So 4 sleep spells? Nope. Not happening. The Spell Slots and Quick Charge ideas are more to my liking. Plus the ideas presented elsewhere appeal to me even more.

Anyways, thats all I have time for right now, more later.

[Omote]

There is a lot about this book that I love. My particular favorites being the chapter that expands combat. I think TLG did a good job coming up with interesting things to do in a combat round now. Some of them were rules that were needed, and others are just pretty interesting options for players. I like that a lot.

The section on Gems is awesome, and treasures by race is just freaking cool.

But by far, my favorite chapters is CH14 ~ Advancing The Game. There are no mechanics in this chapter per se, just great information and advice on adding things to your game. I've been a GM for 22 years+ now, and after reading this chapter I learned even more about the craft. The ideas and the thoughts provided in CH14, are just great, and do expand the game.

~O

[Go0gleplex]

I'd have to say the mana alternative for mages, the equipment wastage stuff, and the crime & punishment sections. There's about 14 other things I've set aside for incorporation but most of those are transparent to the players.

[Treebore]

I definitely like the expanded equipment chapter, in particular the new items covered, from food to the variety of wagons, ships, expanded carrying capacities in case I ever need them and even maintenance.

I've always loved the NPC section in the 1E DMG, so am thrilled to see C&C have their own version, not to mention some material construction rules. Plus HENCHMAN! Woot! Plus loyalty and morale guidelines are always a handy guideline, especially guidelines on how to increase or lose their loyalty and effect their morale, which is doubly important if you use the mass combat rules. They even covered creatures and even intelligent magic items. Good stuff!

Now the world building chapter goes into far more detail than I ever do when I build such things, which has only been twice in my life, I usually just buy published stuff, like Aihrde, Wilderlands, Greyhawk, Faerun, etc... So this is no big deal to me. Plus I have all of Gary's books, and Expeditious Retreats, plus a ton of Harn stuff, so I am not sure what source or source's I would refer to if I am ever inclined to build a world again.

Now the land movement guidelines, getting lost, etc... things like that are definitely of interest.

Same goes for the city chapter, lots of other sources I already own, but having so much of this stuff in one book is very appealing, but I'll have to use it to see how good it is compared to other resources I like to use. I do see myself using the population and occupation charts, I have always liked such charts since the 1E DMG. Crime and Punishment is always cool, but again, my question is which resource will I use when I next need them? Probably the CKG, but when it comes time I will then look and see which works best for me, so for now I do not know.

In the Dungeon section I definitely see myself using the wall hit points chart and the listening guidelines might get used and I definitely see myself getting into the traps section, I am a huge fan of Grimtooth for a reason.

The material on air and water I definitely see myself using, since I don't have a lot of alternative resources on those other than the DMG and some 3E books. So I see these as being my primary source due to it being for the system I am using.

Now on the Equipment wastage/usage, I like the idea, but I am not sold on whether or not I will want to take the time to use them. Still, good reading and food for thought.

Now Land as Treasure I am definitely a big fan of, and used in conjunction with MAgical Medievel Societies: Western Europe and Harn resources one could definitely create tons and tons of great stuff. So looking ofrward to pulling this into my future games.

The War section is an automatic win ever since I used the boxed set already released while running the Saltmarsh modules, so definitely a useful chapter to have, and then with the boxed set, pretty much all you can ask for in terms of a pretty easy to use mass combat system, and my group and I definitely had a great time with it.

Monster Ecology. I always like these and this chapter shows why. It helps get a CK's creative juices going, and helps us to step outside of any box we may find ourselves standing in. So a great chapter.

I found expanding the genre of interest because I have helped play test the hopefully still forthcoming Victorian supers game and even adapted the SIEGE engine to run a short term Traveller sci fi game, plus I also helped play test Star SIEGE. Plus played Go Fer Yer Gun on two occasions. So a good chapter to include if your like me and want to look at and use the SIEGE engine beyond fantasy.

Chapter 14 is definitely a great chapter, more for new CK's, but even us old CK's need some reminders and a different perspective to bounce our own off of. So a good read, old or new.

Now Chapter 15 I personally found to be of practically no use, but I think that is because i have found my answers to all of the questions brought up in this chapter. So for those still searching for such answers, you'll probably like this chapter.

[Relaxo]

I havn't read enough to say yet, but i dig the epic powers, even though I've never played above 12th level in AD&D.

The magic options seem cool. I like the quick recharge option and maybe the spell slots idea

[ssfsx17]

Expanded equipment, complete with classic Troll-style outside-the-box touches such as having Baghdad Batteries be in the equipment list

The whole worldbuilding chapter

Bags of Holding and Portable Holes being useable as mini-black-hole-weapons

Random personalities for henchmen - a classic Serleran-style table that potentially adds a new dimension to the game, yet is beautifully simple

Artwork by Peter Bradley - where does he meet all those hot chicks?

[Tadhg]

I've paged through the book and then I would just open it randomly from time to time and read a paragraph or 2, and/or mebbe part of a section.

Anyway, I've like the following:

Equipment wastage section.

Chapter 6 bits:

fortresses
occupations
construction materials & costs

Traps

Aerial combat (very excellent).

Great stuff so far!

[Treebore]

Chapter 16 on Treasure is just full of awesome. I particularly love the example given of where the PC's are cheated by every merchant they went to, but since they were oblivious to being cheated they left the city happy. Plus the ideas given for spell and magic item creation are cool and the table giving the proper time to cast on top of the main key component is exactly the kind of rules I like.

I agree with Omote that Chapter 17 has a lot of good ideas, as well as good discussion, about combat, in C&C and pretty much any kind of RPG. I also like their quick and most importantly, simple, crit and fumble charts. The effects of terrain is once again a very interesting idea, but again I am not sure if I want to "weigh down" my games with it. Lots of good ideas are entertained here, thogh. Damage Reduction, Wound effects, and lots more are likely to be of interest.

Chapter 18 has a lot of interesting ideas too, of most interest to me are the Advantages, both Heritage and Combat.

Fans of Fate/Luck points will probably like Chapter 19 plus the Trolls give some good thoughts to the issue of PC deaths, and is an appropriate topic on which to end a book like the CKG.

[LordSeurek]

After reading all your comments, I hope my copy comes soon. My wife and I are leaving this town in 3 months (we have been here for 8 years), so I hope it arrives soon

L.S.

[Demiurge]

I've only read about 1/4 of it so far, but I really like the illusionist section. It's a much better take on the class and I can finally wrap my head around their use of healing spells.

The NPC section looks like it'll prove useful too.

[serleran]

That it is done.

Heh, seriously, the things I like the most are the tidbits that inspire... those are spread all through the book and not specific to a section. For example, the treasure section gives ideas, as does the war section. Little things, perhaps, that make me pause and think "there's a way to use that."

Also, I am glad to have been part of its creation. Yay.

[western watcher]

I like equipment wastage. Seems like a good way to keep characters from accumulating excessive amounts of wealth, and adds some "grit" to the game. I also like the alternatives to the "Vancian" system for spell casters. Although, if using the mana system in a campaign I would either not allow attribute modifiers,or reduce base mana by 2 for each level for multi-class, and class and a half characters.

[alcyone]

Spell clarifications, henchmen, new combat maneuvers (called shot!), land as treasure, war, and lots of inspiration throughout.

I was pleased to find that instead of getting a clone of some version of the DMG, I really got a book that stands up to and complements my AD&D DMG, Dungeoneer Survival Guide, and Wilderness Survival Guide. I could use a lot of this stuff in AD&D as easily as I could in C&C.

When I ordered it, I hoped for lots of rule clarifications. As time went on and I waited for it, I either got clarification from the boards, made something up, or realized it didn't matter. Now that I have the book, I see a few of my original questions have gone unanswered, but I am glad they used the paper for something else.

What I like most is my curly cover, enchanted to at least +1 by the Troll Lord's scrawling.

[zarathustra]

I agree the spell clarifications and henchmen section are handy.

I would use the aerial combat rules should it ever come up and the large scale battle system ditto.

The main section that caught my eye was the Advantages. Some of them (not all) will make it into my game, I particularly like the racial ones. I think having 1 advantage to start with and say another one at levels 5 & 10 will be a nice way to increase the power/survivability of the party for tough challenges without having to throw more and more magic at them, which will allow me to keep what magic they have a little bit more unique and special (I'm a every item should have a story guy, not a "here's a +2 dagger" guy).

I still haven't read alot of it thoroughly yet but I got a couple of nice ideas/reminders about subterennean matters too from the dungeon adventures section.

I am one who is really skeptical about adding too much rules & crunch into C&C IMC (I like the simplicity YMMV) so was a bit unsure I'd even want to add anything from this book but I am glad I have it around. I am putting plenty of ideas away in the "I'm not gonna add it in overtly but should the PC's ever attempt this, then I'll knoiw where to look" file.

I feel they went a bit mad with table after table of item saving throws, I think I'll stick with my simple 1 table prime/non prime houserule on that one.

[mordrene]

I cannot wait to yell at the table "we are adhering to the Tyrrany of the Rules at my game!!!"

[zarathustra]

I cannot wait to yell at the table "we are adhering to the Tyrrany of the Rules at my game!!!"

"Am I the only one here who gives a shit about the rules anymore!"

[Zudrak]

I cannot wait to yell at the table "we are adhering to the Tyrrany of the Rules at my game!!!"

"Am I the only one here who gives a shit about the rules anymore!"

I didn't realize he's a grognard.

The Grognard is the guy who will tell you that playing by the rules isn't important, but he gets rabidly upset if anyone changes those rules.

[zarathustra]

I didn't realize he's a grognard.

Yeah, but he never rolls on the shabboth!

[GameOgre]

Henchman section rocks,
Equipment wastage section rocks,
Magic section rocks,
Expanding characters section rocks(mostly)

[mordrene]

I didn't realize he's a grognard.

Yeah, but he never rolls on the shabboth!

SHUT THE F*#@ UP DONNIE. You ont even know what you are talking about.


I Love that movie