AC / Dex bonus for monsters

[kreider204]

Okay, so a PC's AC is adjusted by his DEX bonus, unless he's being attacked unaware, etc., in which case he doesn't get his DEX bonus.

What if a PC attacks an unaware monster? I assume some monsters' ACs reflect DEX rather than just brute physical toughness, but it's not as though the monster books indicate a specific DEX bonus. Should I just ignore that rule? Or make a wild guess about the monster's DEX bonus and subtract it from the AC

Thoughts?

[Omote]

Since monsters do not follow the same mechanical construction method as PCs, there is no bonus to AC from a monster's DEX score. Refer to page 131 of the 4th printing of the PHB for "Situational Modifiers."

~O

[Omote]

The benefit for being surprised is also that the group that successfully surprises gets one free round of attacks. That could be considered benefit enough.

~O

[gideon_thorne]

Use the creatures # of HD as a modifier.

[redwullf]

REAR ATTACK
An attack to the rear of an opponent gives the attacker a +2 bonus to hit. The rogue and assassin do not get this in addition to their back attack
bonus, as it is already considered in their class abilities.

So, I'd just give 'em +2 to hit. This reflects the loss of ability to react to the blow. I'd say an unaware monster would be at least equally unable to react to the blow as one being attacked from behind.

[finarvyn]

I don't tend to give monsters any of the special advantages that PCs get. I often don't give those benefits to NPCs, either, unless they happen to be the Big Baddun. I guess, in my mind, getting AC bonuses and such is part of what makes the PC better than the rest of us.

[Lord Dynel]

I'd give the players a +2 to attack were they to surprise a monster. Seems easy enough.

[kreider204]

Interesting thoughts so far.

I like the simplicity of using the rear attack +2 rule from the PHB. But then it seems as though PCs are doubly penalized when they are attacked from the rear - the attacker gets the +2 AND the PCs lose their DEX bonus ...

[redwullf]

Interesting thoughts so far.

I like the simplicity of using the rear attack +2 rule from the PHB. But then it seems as though PCs are doubly penalized when they are attacked from the rear - the attacker gets the +2 AND the PCs lose their DEX bonus ...

In a word, yes. It's the hard, unfair life of the PC. If the CK feels strongly about it, then he or she can randomize or grant a dexterity value - but I wouldn't personally scratch that deeply for a mere sense of "fairness" or PC/monster rules continuity. It's simpler (and faster!) to take a +2 and move on. Most PCs wouldn't have much of a Dex modifier to surrender anyway, if they really rolled 3d6 for their stats.

[kreider204]

Hey, the CKG allows 4d6!

I gotta be honest: I often forget to nullify the DEX bonus, and I always have, all the way back to my 1st ed. days. Honestly, I think I'm okay with that, though. Even when attacked from the rear, it seems to me DEX could still apply - reflexively rolling with the punch, etc. I think the only time I couldn't rationalize keeping the DEX mod is when the target is completely unconscious or immobile, and then I'm likely to allow an automatic hit anyway ...

[Arduin]

Interesting thoughts so far.

I like the simplicity of using the rear attack +2 rule from the PHB. But then it seems as though PCs are doubly penalized when they are attacked from the rear - the attacker gets the +2 AND the PCs lose their DEX bonus ...

I only drop the Dex bonus if the PC is unaware of the attacker/attack or, they are in hand to hand with someone in front of them at the time.