Changing the game's currency

[Lord Dynel]

I've always wanted to do something different with the currency system. Since my days with 1st edition AD&D I always thought the "gold standard" was a little off. A lot of people simply change the "gp" for "sp" and call it done. I don't think I like that method, really, as all it does is create the same issue, except with silver pieces.

Well, I've recently rediscovered a book that I remember coming out when I was quite the AD&D elitiest - I.C.E.'s "...And a 10-Foot Pole." This book is fantastic! It introduces tin and bronze pieces and these latter pieces along with silver makes for the "standard." This is for Medieval era pricing (they have prices for all major eras of history). Couple that with a very comprehensive list of equipment with weights and production times and availability (by community) and the lists are downright awesome. Also, it seems like they may have priced the items more on line with respect to other items as opposed to with what characters are supposed to afford. I've always gotten the impression that D&D had some out of whack pricing on some things (like a peasant being able to afford one or two drinks on a days pay) and some items not priced in comparison with one another and instead with what PCs are supposed to afford at a given time.

Does anyone have experience with this product? With currency change in general?

[Treebore]

Only in my home campaign. For it I use the silver based pricing of the Harn setting. Which makes the pricing of magic items go into a whole different realm of buying and selling, since I still keep it in gold pieces. So when the majority of your wealth is in silver or less, it becomes that much more difficult to accumulate the needed gold. Same with buying lands and building castles, etc... at the higher levels. So it keeps money "rare", and keeps my players needing to adventure and develop their lands to generate the endless revenue they need to do what they want, let alone keep paying for what they have already done. I tend to be much more realistic about my world economies than most CK's. In fact, I don't know of any CK who pays as much attention to their setting economics as I do. My online group is lucky, I keep their game in the usual "vacuum" of D&D economics.

[Omote]

I do not have any familiarity with the book you describe, but I do use a (sort of) different style of currency in my NecroWorld campaign. In the main city of Bard's Gate, the standard is usually gold, but it is paid for in silver, platinum, and "horns" (which is a half-copper peice). The affluent in the city also use "Waycoin" which is equal to 20 pieces of gold. The bottom 80% use horns, copper, and silver, and the occasional gold piece. The wealthy usually only deal in large coins like platinum, waycoin, and elven silver (which is 50gp in the city).

It is interesting to see the lack of the typical gold piece using these type of currency dynamics.

~O

[Traveller]

I went to a copper-based system and added a tin piece as well. The reason I did so was to rebase the currency system, making gold and silver rare, rather than find arbitrary ways to keep adventurers poor. At the same time, characters earn XP from treasure in the most natural way possible: spending it. With the exception of training costs (25% of the character's "account balance") and tithes for clerics and paladins (10%), every copper piece spent means 1XP.

The fun one is magic items. If they want to sell a magic item they have to find someone not affiliated with the characters to buy it, and they should expect to get a buy offer of no more than about 1/3d the price in Monsters & Treasure. On top of it, selling the magic item doesn't earn them any experience. It just nets them coin, which when spent, earns them experience.

[Arduin]

I base my econ on a s.p. However, I just multiply the g.p. price of items by ~10 to account for the greater value of g.p.'s. Your classic "peasant" deals in barter and doesn't really use coinage much. Sustenance lifestyle. Above this I have craftsmen. They deal in various sizes (values) of solver coins. Copper isn't used much for coins except for debasement purposes.

Here is a quick overview of EU medieval coinage: http://www.economics.utoronto.ca/munro5/MONEYLEC.pdf

[Lurker]

LD. I haven't seen the book (but I am going to put it on my must see list)

As for economies and currency system, that is one area I HATE from D&D ... It has driven me crazy from day 1 !!!!

That said, in my home brew I went to silver as the base (gold is for the wealthy and for BIG purchases). I also went with 1 silver being the pay for an unskilled worker for 1 day's work. That said, most people carry around copper and a little silver. This of course effects the prices of everything so I tried and correct the costs of the stuff most players need/want. I actually found a research project in a college data base that listed estimated prices for classical Greece/Rome (maybe later Rome, I can't remember exactly). That helped out a lot. Unfortunately, what notes I have are in storage down in FL, plus they are far from complete. (That makes me want to see the ICE book even more).

Tree, I haven't dug into Harn for their pricing. However, I do like your "I use the silver based pricing of the Harn setting. Which makes the pricing of magic items go into a whole different realm of buying and selling". I'll have to see what I have on Harn and think about using it ... thanks

[Treebore]

Tree, I haven't dug into Harn for their pricing. However, I do like your "I use the silver based pricing of the Harn setting. Which makes the pricing of magic items go into a whole different realm of buying and selling". I'll have to see what I have on Harn and think about using it ... thanks

Your welcome, and don't forget there is a ton of free Harn stuff on Lythia.com, from manors to herbs, to price lists.

[serleran]

I have the book mentioned. I don't use it. That doesn't mean it's not good and useful. I just like to try and make things easier on me.

I find that I make prices whatever I feel like making them based on 1) how much money is coming and going which is different for every community (I basically just write down a stat for a town called "inflation" and give it a multiplier, like x3 or x.001 to reflect the relative scarcity of wealth in that place; 2) how much money the party is slinging around (the more they start dropping 1k+ at places, or requesting specific items, the more others start to charge them...), and 3) whether there is a war or some other event which really is the basis for my inflation value but can apply to specific types of items only (i.e., in a war environment, armor and weapons might be x2 - x 10 but food might be .5x or .25x)

I don't play with changing the GP values unless I think a particular price is ridiculous. I often consider places to be in "boomtown" mode, which is why some prices are astronomical and others are rather weird.

[Ronin77]

I don't have the mentioned book. In the past I have put some thought into changing the currency, But in the end we just went back to as written. More out of playability and the fact that it doesnt bother me that much.

[Lord Dynel]

Well (now that I'm home), I can go a little more in depth on the book, for those that don't know much about it.

It was a supplement put out in the early 90s, primarily for use with the Rolemaster system. Now, Rolemaster uses a system of money that is all "base 10" (I guess that's the right way to put it), which 10 of one coin equals one of the next highest denomination. So:

10 iron pieces (ip) = 1 1 tin piece (tn)
10 tin pieces = 1 copper pieces (cp)
10 copper pieces = 1 bronze piece (bp)
10 bronze pieces = 1 silver pieces (sp)
10 silver pieces = 1 gold piece (gp)
10 gold pieces = 1 platinum pieces (pp)
10 platinum pieces = 1 mithril piece (mp)

In neither book (...And a 10-Foot Pole and the RMFRP core book I own) could I find any items priced in iron or mithril pieces, so I can eliminate those right away. So, the lowest denomination I'd use is the tin piece, the highest would be platinum. Even though there's no references to platinum, either, in the price lists I could find I'd still keep it as a viable coinage. So, while 10 sp still equals a gold piece, the inclusion of tin and bronze, and bronze's role as one of the standard coins, makes gold a rarer sight, and makes platinum nearly legendary. At least in my thinking. Sure, someone might have 20 silver pieces saved up from weeks or months of hard work, but having 2 gold pieces means you're somebody. I don't know, maybe that sound crazy. so it appears that bronze is this system's silver, and silver is this system's gold. That leaves gold and platinum to be a bit more precious.

Anyway, here's some excerpts from the book:


This a list of miscellaneous equipment, its cost, its weight, how big it is, it's availability, and the time it takes to construct. The next three columns are RM specific, to my knowledge. Then there is a notes field which gives any pertinent information, if necessary.


Animals. The ft./rnd might be nice to use but I have that with the C&C stat blocks. I like the mph, though. and their carrying capacity.


Weapons. I'm not really concerned about the "Type" column, but the construction time is (as it is for all the tables) a very nice thing to have.

These are examples of "Medieval Era" prices.

I like the availability, too, for all the charts. They are listed as (A)ll, (C)ity, (T)own, and (R)ural. The book suggests that items found outside their geographical area (like farming tools in a town) should less likely be available and cost more. It gives specifics in the text of the book.

Anyway, I like it and may possibly use the book for its prices, availability, and craft times at the very least. Just about everything item from the C&C PHB I've been able to find in this book.

[koralas]

I have used the "silver standard" for quite some time, and have altered the relative value of the coins. I also have used multiple mints, which can get a bit complex as the players have to track what mint each type of coin came from. Further certain regions would have the relative worth of the different coins be different, which add's the CK's complexity. The most obvious real-world example was Ancient Egypt where gold was more plentiful than silver, thus silver had a higher value. While these latter two systems add realism, it adds the need to watch for the level of complexity being added. For the campaigns I used them, they added to the fun even with the complexity added.

For the most part I now just use different coin values in the silver system. i.e. 1pp=15gp=75sp=375cp=3750bp(bronze)=18750ip(iron)

I also tend to make adjustments to equipment beyond setting the base coin type to silver, cost on most simple items drops one type, standard remain the same, difficult raise one, and complex raises by two coin types.

For example

• Simple - Leather, Hide, Padded armor
• Standard - Studded leather, Cuire Bouille, Lamillar
• Difficult - all type of links based armor (chain), Coat of Plates, Scale
• Complex - Ensembles, all other Plate Armor

[Lurker]

Your welcome, and don't forget there is a ton of free Harn stuff on Lythia.com, from manors to herbs, to price lists.

Lythia.com That's the site ... Its been years sense I've looked at it. I couldn't remember where I had copied the Harn stuff from. Too bad I can't remember which back up drive I'd save the stuff on. I'll have to go there and give the price list a look.

Well (now that I'm home), I can go a little more in depth on the book, for those that don't know much about it.

It was a supplement put out in the early 90s, primarily for use with the Rolemaster system. Now, Rolemaster uses a system of money that is all "base 10" (I guess that's the right way to put it), which 10 of one coin equals one of the next highest denomination. So:

10 iron pieces (ip) = 1 1 tin piece (tn)
10 tin pieces = 1 copper pieces (cp)
10 copper pieces = 1 bronze piece (bp)
10 bronze pieces = 1 silver pieces (sp)
10 silver pieces = 1 gold piece (gp)
10 gold pieces = 1 platinum pieces (pp)
10 platinum pieces = 1 mithril piece (mp)

...
These are examples of "Medieval Era" prices.

I like the availability, too, for all the charts. They are listed as (A)ll, (C)ity, (T)own, and (R)ural. The book suggests that items found outside their geographical area (like farming tools in a town) should less likely be available and cost more. It gives specifics in the text of the book.

Anyway, I like it and may possibly use the book for its prices, availability, and craft times at the very least. Just about everything item from the C&C PHB I've been able to find in this book.

LD thanks for posting that. The denomination is actually close to what I created on my own (except I have 1 gp = 20 silver, that is closer to the Roman standard). that makes me feel better about my home brew.

I like the availability and days to construct. Those would come in handy.

Well the cadets are headed this way. Have a good one

[zombiehands]

On a side note the capacity of camels is very under rated in C&C and apparently Role master too.
Camels can carry up 990lbs, but 330 lbs was considered a standard load.

[Lord Dynel]

You're welcome, Lurker. I think I like the currency system and the lists. It keeps the base 10 players have gotten used to, but changes the values of things quite nicely, in my opinion with the new coinage instituted. And yeah, the availability and construction time are sweet. If nothing else is taken away from this book, and I end up keeping the C&C system, I'll use that.

I'm trying to figure out starting money, though. If I'm looking at it correctly, I might leave the starting money the same for all classes, but have that be silver pieces instead of gold. I need to playtest that a little bit first, though. If that works out, then it should be incorporated in time for my new campaign.

[Sir Ironside]

Even back in my AD&D era, I've always had a problem with the gold standard. Never bothered to change it because no one else seemed to be bothered by it and I wasn't going to do any converting when no one cared.

The first silver standard was Chivalry & Sorcery 1st edition. (I have no idea if the kept it in subsequent editions.) It just seemed to fit and I liked it a lot better.

The only real life history, that I can think of, that had silver as more rare than gold was Egypt. Until, through trade with the Eastern markets, flooded Egypt with cheap silver.

[Lurker]

As a history guy, I hate to admit that I never put 2 & 2 together with Egypt having access to gold and not silver, and the idea that would make silver more valuable to them ... I guess I've been waisting my time taking edu classes and not cool geek info classes

LD, rgr on the issue with starting gold. That is the one nut I haven't been able to crack with my changes ... That said, you might have the right idea about just leaving that alone. It may not be worth the effort.

Oh yeah, with the various eras in the book, how does the Medieval compare to the viking/end of Rome and classic Greco Roman eras? Those are the time frames I'm most drawn too in my home brew.

[koralas]

As a history guy, I hate to admit that I never put 2 & 2 together with Egypt having access to gold and not silver, and the idea that would make silver more valuable to them ... I guess I've been waisting my time taking edu classes and not cool geek info classes

I was surprised to hear it at first as well. It was at it's peak value in the Old Kingdom, then became more available in the Middle Kingdom lowering it's value until it ultimately was lower than gold, and by the New Kingdom there was a ready supply, so it's value was lowered even further.

Interesting side note, the ancient Egyptians believed that gold was the skin of their god's, and that their bones were of silver.

[Go0gleplex]

Now if you really wanted to mess around with things, consider the equivalent value of one country's coin vs another's. Say the economy in one country is flourishing and thus the silver content of its coins is greater than the neighboring country with a lower silver purity of their coins due to a poorer economy. Wars are not just fought with sword and shield, but with money and markets as well.

The short questions are;

who makes the coins?
what is the 'guarantee' behind each particular coin/currency issue made?
how do the markets see their value?

Who says watching anime is worthless?

[Lord Dynel]

LD, rgr on the issue with starting gold. That is the one nut I haven't been able to crack with my changes ... That said, you might have the right idea about just leaving that alone. It may not be worth the effort.

Oh yeah, with the various eras in the book, how does the Medieval compare to the viking/end of Rome and classic Greco Roman eras? Those are the time frames I'm most drawn too in my home brew.

Well, Lurker, I found one guy's extensive review of the the book and he noticed (with some examples provided) that 10-Foot Pole's bronze pieces matched to D&D's (what he used in his example) silver pieces in all his examples to nearly a 1:1 ratio. Since my original thought was to go off of the gold piece standard, and more on lesser coins - and taking into account this reviewer's ratio - just make the starting gold for C&C starting silver. This bronze/silver piece correlation should match up to D&D'c (and C&C's) silver/gold piece correlation quite nicely.

Since 80-90% of the prices in 10-Foot Pole are bronze/silver what I might do, and have just begun to consider it, is to further change the rate of gold. Convert any prices of gold pieces from gp to sp (gp value x 10) and then having a gp worth 100 silver pieces instead. I don't know if I'll do this or not, though. If I do, I'd probably get rid of the platinum piece altogether. Now I start asking myself, "is there some way I can accomplish this using the existing system?" I probably could, but it doesn't account for how the prices are established in 10-Foot Pole and how I prefer them (at the moment ) over the D&D-based prices.

As far as Greco-Roman prices, Lurker, what they have are Iron Age/Roman Empire era (And before that they have Bronze Age). Prices, I noticed were about the same, interestingly enough. I don't know if this is for game balance issues and ease of play, or something else. I'm not saying there aren't differences, I just looked at three items (a light horse, a short sword, and leather breastplate) and they were all the same. One place I did notice was in the amount of items available (and rightly so). The weapons and armor sections in the Medieval Era are considerably larger than their Roman Age counterparts. I didn't notice availability, though, and construction time and whether there was a difference or not there.

[Lurker]

...
I don't know if I'll do this or not, though. If I do, I'd probably get rid of the platinum piece altogether. Now I start asking myself, "is there some way I can accomplish this using the existing system?" I probably could, but it doesn't account for how the prices are established in 10-Foot Pole and how I prefer them (at the moment ) over the D&D-based prices.

Well, for my home brew, I had a standard gp (like I said worth 20 sp) and then a large gp (I can't remember if it's face value was x1.5 or x2 normal gp). Then on top of that I had gold and silver ingots. They weren't a carry around in your money bag kind of coins. They were for BIG amounts and purchasing large items - ie a bank had them or the wealthiest of the land owners had them to buy farms etc off each other, but few commoners every saw them. That said, the adventures got them buy either raiding a rival city’s bank, a pirate/trading outpost, etc. Oh yeah the large gp came from a note I read about Creaser commissioning a special coin to pay his most loyal troops, so they were for special bonuses and being given one was a mark of favor, so they were worth more than just their face value. (At least at first, a couple of players actually made their first one good luck coins and kept them for years, but then would trade off the other ones at face value).

As far as Greco-Roman prices, Lurker, what they have are Iron Age/Roman Empire era (And before that they have Bronze Age). Prices, I noticed were about the same, interestingly enough. I don't know if this is for game balance issues and ease of play, or something else. I'm not saying there aren't differences, I just looked at three items (a light horse, a short sword, and leather breastplate) and they were all the same. One place I did notice was in the amount of items available (and rightly so). The weapons and armor sections in the Medieval Era are considerably larger than their Roman Age counterparts. I didn't notice availability, though, and construction time and whether there was a difference or not there

Well, I'm not an expert, but to me that kind of makes sense (similarities between bronze & Iron Age prices). To me (if I remember correctly) the biggest issues came when a country/city state debases their coins, or when later Rome went down the price fixing road.

Also, rgr on the availabilities between the eras.

Again thanks, it makes me want this book even more

[Geleg]

great thread.

I've also been bothered by the monetary and economic systems of D&D (and C&C) for years.

'real' world monetary systems (by which I mean Roman and/or medieval Europe) were bi- or tri-metallic. The romans had bronze coins, used largely in cities by ordinary people for everyday items, but the main coins were silver (denarius) and gold (solidus), and the silver denarius was a standard unit of account. Most medieval polities inherited the denarius/solidus system as the base, although for a good part of the period from c.700-1200 nobody really minted solidi.

So the model for most european-style fantasy games is a coinage system based on the silver piece. (we also know it could be cut up, into farthings for instance). Why Gary decided to adopt the system he did is beyond me.

I broached the subject of the wonky economics of D&D/C&C to my players and they looked at me in fond puzzlement. They like getting gold and don't really care about the unrealistic features of the coinage system or, what to my mind is an even bigger problem, the issue of money supply and inflation.

So, despite constantly worrying about these things, I've decided that it's not worth my time to completely revise the economy.

[Sir Ironside]

Why Gary decided to adopt the system he did is beyond me.

Heroic theme needs heroic loot? Even though the gold pieces are the standard and there is a lot of it to devalue the the monetary system a person playing D&D subconsciously understands the real world value, which makes finding gold coins more exciting than finding silver or copper pieces?

I remember playing AD&D and finding gold pieces had a rush to it and finding silver or copper pieces usually meant you left it behind, with some disappointment.

A total guess on my part.

[Arduin]

So the model for most european-style fantasy games is a coinage system based on the silver piece. (we also know it could be cut up, into farthings for instance). Why Gary decided to adopt the system he did is beyond me.
...They like getting gold and don't really care about the unrealistic features of the coinage system or, what to my mind is an even bigger problem, the issue of money supply and inflation.
.

Gary covered this topic in the original DMG. In part: "There is no question that the prices and costs of the game are based on inflationary economy, one where a sudden influx of silver and gold has driven everything well beyond its normal value. The reasoning behind this is simple. An active campaign will most certainly bring a steady flow of wealth into the base area, as adventurers come from successful trips into dungeon and wilderness. If the economy of the area is one which more accurately reflects that of medieval England, let us say, where coppers and silver coins are usual and a gold piece remarkable, such an influx of new money, even in copper and silver, would cause an inflationary spiral"

[Lord Dynel]

Why Gary decided to adopt the system he did is beyond me.

Heroic theme needs heroic loot? Even though the gold pieces are the standard and there is a lot of it to devalue the the monetary system a person playing D&D subconsciously understands the real world value, which makes finding gold coins more exciting than finding silver or copper pieces?

I remember playing AD&D and finding gold pieces had a rush to it and finding silver or copper pieces usually meant you left it behind, with some disappointment.

A total guess on my part.

I see where you're coming from, Ironside, but that's part of my issue. Gold should be heroic loot, sure. I think it should be more heroic and precious than it is. And I still have seen, recently actually, the part I bolded in your post. I'd like to see a method where they rush to the pile when it's gold, but still bag up the piles of silver and copper. That's what I think's wrong with the system...or at least my problem with it. When you pay for everything in hundred dollar bills, ones and tens seem to get looked over. The method I'm considering adopting will have you pay with many to most things with ones, a lot of things with ten's, and not much at all with hundreds...but hundreds are still hundreds.

[Arduin]

That's what I think's wrong with the system...or at least my problem with it. When you pay for everything in hundred dollar bills, ones and tens seem to get looked over. The method I'm considering adopting will have you pay with many to most things with ones, a lot of things with ten's, and not much at all with hundreds...but hundreds are still hundreds.

I dealt with that long ago. The average merchant can't make that much "change". That's what "money changers" are for. All those GP's in the musty dungeons? Most aren't local currency and must be changed in order to be used...

[Lord Dynel]

That's what I think's wrong with the system...or at least my problem with it. When you pay for everything in hundred dollar bills, ones and tens seem to get looked over. The method I'm considering adopting will have you pay with many to most things with ones, a lot of things with ten's, and not much at all with hundreds...but hundreds are still hundreds.

I dealt with that long ago. The average merchant can't make that much "change". That's what "money changers" are for. All those GP's in the musty dungeons? Most aren't local currency and must be changed in order to be used...

I've tried that, too. The problem I've had with that is the bookkeeping involved. If they run from dungeon to town, and trade it all in, then it's not a problem. If they hold onto it, go into five other dungeons, find more and different strange, old coins (that don't exchange at the same rate the others did) then it becomes a headache. I know it's great realism, but I'm not looking that far up the realism scale. To me, a gold piece is a gold piece. The only difference might be if they go very far (like across an ocean, and then gold might not even be a currency!). So making the standard gold piece more valuable has been my goal.

[Arduin]

I've tried that, too. The problem I've had with that is the bookkeeping involved. If they run from dungeon to town, and trade it all in, then it's not a problem. If they hold onto it, go into five other dungeons, find more and different strange, old coins (that don't exchange at the same rate the others did) then it becomes a headache. I know it's great realism, but I'm not looking that far up the realism scale. To me, a gold piece is a gold piece. The only difference might be if they go very far (like across an ocean, and then gold might not even be a currency!). So making the standard gold piece more valuable has been my goal.

Even if a GP is a GP, they still need to change them if the local currency is silver based because of the "making change" problem in smaller towns. The point is keeping the econ running on the "Silver penny" or, what not.

[Treebore]

That's what I think's wrong with the system...or at least my problem with it. When you pay for everything in hundred dollar bills, ones and tens seem to get looked over. The method I'm considering adopting will have you pay with many to most things with ones, a lot of things with ten's, and not much at all with hundreds...but hundreds are still hundreds.

I dealt with that long ago. The average merchant can't make that much "change". That's what "money changers" are for. All those GP's in the musty dungeons? Most aren't local currency and must be changed in order to be used...

I've tried that, too. The problem I've had with that is the bookkeeping involved. If they run from dungeon to town, and trade it all in, then it's not a problem. If they hold onto it, go into five other dungeons, find more and different strange, old coins (that don't exchange at the same rate the others did) then it becomes a headache. I know it's great realism, but I'm not looking that far up the realism scale. To me, a gold piece is a gold piece. The only difference might be if they go very far (like across an ocean, and then gold might not even be a currency!). So making the standard gold piece more valuable has been my goal.

Why go through all that trouble? Just guess. Make a reasonable average estimate. Close is more than good enough for this. If you know one would be 10%, another would be 20%, and the others would be some where in the middle, just go with 15%. We aren't trying to send rocket ships to Mars here, estimates work fine.

[Lord Dynel]

I've tried that, too. The problem I've had with that is the bookkeeping involved. If they run from dungeon to town, and trade it all in, then it's not a problem. If they hold onto it, go into five other dungeons, find more and different strange, old coins (that don't exchange at the same rate the others did) then it becomes a headache. I know it's great realism, but I'm not looking that far up the realism scale. To me, a gold piece is a gold piece. The only difference might be if they go very far (like across an ocean, and then gold might not even be a currency!). So making the standard gold piece more valuable has been my goal.

Even if a GP is a GP, they still need to change them if the local currency is silver based because of the "making change" problem in smaller towns. The point is keeping the econ running on the "Silver penny" or, what not.

That's true, but whether or not a longsword costs 15 gp or 150 sp really doesn't solve my problem. If it does for you, that's great. But to me I look at it and ask myself, "What does this really solve?"

But no, I've done that lots of times. "Sorry, <Player A>, the shopkeeper doesn't take gold pieces. You need to go to the moneychanger to exchange those gold coins into silver ones." The only thing this does is make 10 silver pieces more valuable than 1 gold piece, interestingly enough (assuming the exchange rate is 10%). So, this actually devalues the gold piece, in my interpretation, making it less valuable than an equal value of silver. Sure, it puts a minor drain in the player's coin purses (more if the exchange rate is higher) and might add a tad or realism, but I think it does little for the value of the gold piece.

[Treebore]

Agreed. The most meaningful way to change the value of gold is to change its exchange rate. Instead of having it 10 silver to 1 gold, have it be 20 silver, or even 50 silver.

The biggest problem with doing this is you have to build ALL the price lists from the ground up, including magic items.

Be careful, though. If you run published adventures, or run your own "stuff" in a fashion similar to published adventures, meaning how often magic will be obtained, you do not want to make magic too valuable. This is because the simple reality of even your game is, the players will accumulate enough magic that they will want to eventually sell some of it. So if you make magic super expensive to buy, it will garner them super amounts of gold. This is because magic items do not "devalue" like other goods. A 500 year old +2 set of Full Plate is still as useful and valuable as the brand new set the 10th level party mage just made.

I have actually been successful in mitigating this by having my players accumulate hirelings, henchman and followers. This is because they will give the "old" magic items to these NPC's before they will sell it. It hasn't stopped them from wanting to sell off everything they could, but it has had them keep far more of it than they would without these NPC's.

Another way I have justified giving them far below the "going" price is by having the easiest to find buyers be Mage Guilds and Temples. This is because these people can make their own versions. So to make it worth while for them to buy it rather than make it themselves, the price has to be low enough for them to pay the gold rather than invest the time and their own resources into making it. So I usually give them somewhere between 25 to 50% of "list" prices. If the players really want to make the gold then I force them to waste game time hunting for buyers who not only cannot make the item themselves, but are wealthy enough to even buy it, which cuts out about 99.5% of the population right off the top.

Then they have to be careful not to attract the attention of crooks who are skilled and powerful enough to just steal the item or items from the players. Which, I have to admit, has turned into awesome game hooks. I have never seen players be more driven than to go after someone who has robbed them. Heck, I am seeing it in my current Slavelords game, since the Slave Lords managed to capture the party and strip them of all their magic items. Since they were 8th and 9th level and had gone through a lot of 1E TSR modules, they lost a lot of magic items, and powerful ones too. Now that they have escaped, they are very driven to recover them.

So as CK's, we have a lot of options, including the option to keep it simple, and not weigh ourselves down with detailed book keeping either. Just being in the ball park is more than close enough for gaming.