Spellcaster House Rules?

[Shadowslayer]

Hi guys. Just curious how many guys are playing with tweaks to their spellcasting system.

I've been out of practice, but remembering back in the day, I was never really satisfied with the spell system. Fire and forget didn't make much sense, and if you memorized the wrong spells you were out of luck. On the other hand, spell slots and spell points...as a DM I was never thrilled with the idea of the PCs being able to cast the same spell at will, over and over...too much room for abuse. (and I'm more than ready to accept that maybe I'm more paranoid about that than I need to be.)

Anyway, I was just wondering out loud what everyone else is doing, and what everyone's thoughts are. I lean towards just doing it as written straight out of the PHB, but I can be sold.

[Arduin]

I do the main rules right out of the PHB, except for catrips. After 35+ years of me fiddling, I found it works the best as written.

[Treebore]

I am preparing to play with a Spell Point system that I posted about here a few weeks ago, but as for what I actually have been specifically doing, the following are my specific spell casting House Rules, taken from my full House Rules document found in my thread in the online gaming forum:

Clerics:
Clerics can do SIEGE checks similar to Wizards.
Clerics can spontaneously convert spells to damage healing spells (IE restore HP's)
Clerics get to add their level to damage healing spells, which increases the amount healed up to the maximum. For example Cure Light cast by a 5th level Cleric rolls 1d8+5 up to a maximum of 8, not 13.

TURN UNDEAD: On a successful check, where not all are affected due to the die roll, an attempt can be made every round until they are turned, or the WIS check actually fails.

Druids:
They can go one of two paths, animal or elemental. Either path gains the ability to become a Treant at 9th level. At 6th level you choose which path you will follow. Animal can choose animal forms to chang into. Elementalists choose one fo the 4 elementals, earth, air, fire, and water. One form at 6th, 7th, 8th, and 9th level, and you get the Treant form too. So by 9th level a Druid will be able to assume each elemental form and a Treant form, or 4 animal forms and a treant form.

Your HD and HP will be the same in your animal and elemental form. In animal/elemental form your BtH will equal your HD, and you gain the movement and special defenses of the animal/elemental form you have. Your damage and attacks are the same as the Animal/Elemental form as well.

Animal choices are fixed, but can be changed via a 3 day ritual cleansing and re-dedication to a new "totem".

At 12th level you can assume each chosen form 2/day. It becomes 3/day at 18th.

Paladins:
When they gain the Smite Evil ability they can use it once per day per level. OR they can choose to have "religious enemy" under the same rules as the Ranger's "enemy". Then choose a new one every two levels, like the Ranger does. They can only do one or the other, not both Smite and Religious Enemy. To clarify "enemy" choice, as a Paladin I allow it to also add +2 to Damage, and you can track them as well. However to explain why you can Track them and nothing else we will call it a divine power that acts like a very specific "Locate Object/Person" spell that lasts while there is a physical trail that could be followed by a Ranger.


Wizards:
SIEGE checks can be used to alter spells being cast. A SIEGE check can be made to change the energy type of a spell. For example, to change a fireball to a electric ball, ice ball, etc... you make a TN 12 check + your level to beat a CL = to the level of the spell. So to change the fireball to ice would be a CL 3, so beat TN 15.

Similar checks can be done to maximize damage, CL spell level +3

To double range, CL spell level +3

To increase number of targets effected, CL spell level +3 per additional target (example spell, Charm Person to effect two people instead of one)

Failure, in all cases, loses you the spell. Roll a natural 1 and pray for survival if it causes damage.

SPELL CASTERS:
A new class ability for ALL spell casters, except Paladins.

Divine/Arcane blasts. These are a pure energy attack that any spell caster can use every other round as long as they do not cast any spells on the round in between. Yes, this means all day long. This is because that round is a recharge/gather the power round. This attack requires a "To hit" roll versus the targets AC, but the casters BtH for purposes of this attack is equal to their level and its modified by their DEX. Damage is 1d4 per level of the caster and requires a "item" as the component for this ability. It costs 20 GP per dice of damage. Typically a cleric uses their Holy Symbol and Arcane Casters most frequently make a wand.

As usual, I do allow a SIEGE check to cast this every round, it will be CON based, and failed checks will cost a temporary loss of one CON point to simulate the exhaustive nature of wasting the energy as well as gathering it so quickly. The CL will equal the amount of dice you want to do for damage, and the base TN will always be 12, since this is now a "Class Ability" for all spell casters.


Lost CON is regained at 1 point per hour of rest, or from a Lesser Restoration.

For Bran's games: Wizards are "sorcerers, and can use Illusionist spells as well, and they "know" all spells automatically, and are limited to casting the "spells per day". Yeah, its broken as hell, but he is still young.


RUNEMARKS:
Are a rune based wizard. Plus everything class related is based off of their Wisdom, not intelligence.

Why? Because rune magic is literally based on word fragments of the "Words of Creation". So rune magic, and the fragments of the words of power used, are the ultimate source of all powers, divine and arcane. So they are treated as Divine, but might be able to use arcane items. Arcane item use is explained later.

Advantages: You only need to have your rune in hand to cast the spell and be able to speak the word of power associated with that spell. So all spells are verbal and material only, with the only material being the spell specific rune stone.

So Runemarks can be tied up, but as long as they have the runestone in their hands, and can speak, they can cast the spell. If they do a successful SIEGE check CL=spell level +4 they can cast the spell by will alone. The runestone is still required to be in hand. So even gagged they can still cast a spell if the SIEGE check is successful. Wizards can do this, but to do it bound and gagged would be a CL=spell level +8 to do so.

Rune stones are made out of expensive materials, but are re-useable. Rune stones cost 25 GP for first level, 35 GP for second level, 50 GP for third level, and 100 GP for levels 4 to 6, then 50 GP per level for levels 7 to 9 (350 GP to 450 GP per spell), with certain price exceptions for spells like Wish, etc... Those costs will be double of what is in the PH, but the rune stone is not consumed.


Biggest drawback: Unlike a mage losing a spell book, if you lose your runestones you can't cast another spell until you make new rune stones for the spells you know/have memorized.

Plus Runemark's cannot use Wizard or Illusionist magic items easily. They must make a SIEGE check versus TN 12 + level the item is made at to use it successfully. If they fail the SIEGE check they can never use that particular item until later. If they succeed they can use that particular item, or item power, from then on. Scrolls can never be used in this manner. Potions can be freely used like any other class. Fail the SIEGE check and they can never use that particular item, or item power, until they make another level to get another SIEGE check to try and figure it out.


Rune magic items:

Runemarks cannot cast arcane or divine classed scrolls, nor do they make scrolls. Runesticks are made in place of scrolls, but for all intents and purposes works just like a scroll. Costs of a runestick are twice that of normal scrolls, but otherwise is the same in terms of time to make them.
They use rods, staves, and wands (very similiar looking to runesticks), but they are all rune based, so called Rune Rods, Rune Staves, and Rune Wands. They can also make potions, but the container is used to empower the fluid inside, so rune potion containers are typically bigger than normal potion vials because of this.

Runemark Skills: Runemarks are very good at engraving and carving, as well as identifying metals and gemstones, since they are so crucial to the basics of making runestones and rune items. All checks, when related to runecasting and making rune items, are WIS based. Otherwise it will be related to DEX, or whatever stat the CK considers relevant.



SIEGE Checks:

As you probably guessed, I allow SIEGE checks to be used for a lot of things other than skills. They can be used by fighters to try and get extra attacks, to get an extra attack when you take an opponent down, to transfer points from your BtH to your damage roll, if you think of it, ask me if you can do it. If you have played 3E many of their feats are good ideas for SIEGE checks.

IMPORTANT: If you successfully use a SIEGE check frequently enough to perform a specific kind of action I will eventually, when I decide to do so, award it as a "signature move". This will mean that as long as your opponent is no more than 3 levels higher than you, or lower, you will not need to perform a SIEGE check to do the "signature move". You can have as many "signature moves" as I decide to award you with.

***I also allow all class abilities to be treated as if you have the relevant attribute as a Prime.

Specific Rules changes:

Spell Casting: In an attempt to have as much clarity as possible, this is the way I have spell casting work. All spell casting begins on "10", in the initiative order. This is when you decide what you are casting for the round, or beginning this round. So 10 is when you start, and the actual number rolled for initiative is when it will come into effect. Which will be during the current round with spells of CT 1, and a subsequent round for spells longer than CT 1, even if its 10 minutes later, as long as no disruption occurs in the mean time.

So if your casting a CT 1 spell, you declare your spell on 10, and if you roll a 10 for initiative, your able to cast the spell with lightning speed for whatever reason as well as have its effect come into being on 10. Normally you just start on 10, and declare what the spell is your casting. Then on your initiative roll, the spell goes into effect. This is when you designate the target or target area, then range etc... is verified, and the effect occurs.

SR note, all creatures with an SR will have their score bumped by 1, to account for the anomaly caused by an SR of 1 on a D20. This means ratings of 21 or higher will be immune to magic, unless spells are found or researched specifically for lowering SR.


You can half move and still cast a spell in the same round for CT 1 spells, BUT moving only occurs AFTER your done casting the spell on your initiative turn. So if you go on a 1 in the round (the end of the round), you get no movement. You cannot move when casting spells taking a full round or longer to cast.

POLYMORPH HOUSE RULES:

To mostly clarify polymorph effects, but some rule specifics are in here.

You can only polymorph into creatures twice own size and weight. Which means Creatures descriptions which put them as being taller OR heavier than twice the casters cannot be polymorphed into.

Example: So if you are 6 foot tall and 170 LBS you can Poly into a Ogre or Troll, but not giants or horses. They exceed the height and/or weight limit.

When Polymorphed (self, or other, by the caster) the caster can manipulate the STR of the form, even a "buffed up" version of yourself.

CL=2xSTR increase

Example: Your STR is 13 and you want the new form to be an 18.
CL-2x5=10
Failure: STR stays 13
Crit Fail: STR drops by 5 to an 8
Crit Success: +2 to STR score, so an 18 becomes 20.

Items Worn:

Small things like rings, earrings, bracers, shoes/small boots, necklaces, etc... "meld into" the new form. Unless the new form is still "humanoid", even if size is changed, so are the items changed. IE your clothes. Armor, etc... change size with you, as long as you remain “humanoid” (human shaped). If they meld they become inactive if they are magical. If they do not meld because you assume a humanoid form, then they still work. Plus they can still be recognized.

Larger things, like pants, knee high boots, armor, helmets, shirts, large necklaces, etc... fall off. This is because your body will ooze right out of them, since they cannot be absorbed.

So stuff dropped like this will have to be picked up by the caster in their new from, or some ally will have to pick them up, etc....


TELEPORTING:

I personally think that Teleporting from anywhere you wish, to anywhere you wish is more powerful then teleporting from locations you have to prepare with a circle/pillars/etc...

So I am changing up the order in which you receive the spells, and altering them a little bit. At 5th level you get Teleport Circle, its duration is “instantaneous”, not 1 turn per level. Its CT is a full round, meaning it always goes off on a initiative of “1”. Which means you, and whomever is going with you, needs to be within the circle when you finish casting.

Teleport is now a 7th level spell, but is otherwise the same.

There is still an 8th level Teleport Circle, and it is as written other than still taking a full round to cast. IE it goes off at “1” on the round in which it is cast.

Teleport W/O Error is now a 9th level spell.

Teleport Circle spells teleport 250 pounds per caster level of creatures and equipment.

No circle means they teleport 1 person/creature/2 caster levels and all those creatures are wearing and holding, or 100 pounds of equipment/objects. Combinations are not possible.

There is a 9th level Teleport Circle that has a casting time of 8 hours and a permanent duration when cast and has a material component cost of 10,000 GP. The area of effect is determined by the size of the component(s) used to create the spell. The weight limit per caster level can be multiplied ([250]x2, x4, etc...) by adding 1000 GP in components per multiple (x2=2000 GP, x4=4000 GP, and so on.)

So to have it teleport 1000 pounds per level that is a x4 multiplier so the material component cost is 14,000 GP.

The material can be whatever the caster wants (standing stones, a circle of solid silver 30 foot in
diameter, a doorway, archway, pool of mercury, etc...)


The End.

[Shadowslayer]

Interesting. Looks like the two extremes are well represented here!

I like what you've done Treebore, but my guys are first timers...that all would be too much for them. Although I like the Arcane/Divine blast idea. I had considered something like that for Wizards (IMO Clerics don't need much help)

I was looking at allowing at-will cantrips, and allowing Mage Hand to do a little damage from a flung object, or add a wizard bolt... one that does a little damage, like 1d4 with a to-hit roll. Basically something that might help counter the suckiness of being a low level wizard.

[Jack C]

I use the Mana system from the CKG, agreed that the Vancian system was never to my liking.

[Treebore]

Its not that hard on the players. All they have to remember is they can do a SIEGE check to try and do things like Maximize a spells damage, increase the spell range, change it from one energy type to another, etc... and if they fail, they lose that spell. I do the Cleric spontaneous thing so they don't have to memorize any healing spells. So its up to the CK to remember the particulars.

Also, if your interested, you can try and find my Skyrim skills adaptation. Its far from complete, but I got a good start on it.

[finarvyn]

I have a house rule for spellcasting that works pretty well for me. It's basically a spell point system.

0) Ignore cantrips. Spellcasters can cast those "at will."
1) For a spellcaster, count up the total number of spells they can cast. (Example: 5/2/1 would be 3 because we ignore the 5 cantrips.)
2) For a spellcaster, count up the total number of spell levels they can cast. (Example: 5/2/1 would be 5*0 + 2*1 +1*2 = 4)
3) For a spellcaster, note the highest spell level he can cast. (Example: 5/2/1 would be 2nd level.)

So the spellcaster can cast any spells he likes as long as he doesn't violate my three rules above. (Example: no more than 3 spells totalling no more than 4 spell levels, none higher than 2nd level spells. So he could cast 2 2nd level spells before he runs out of spell levels, or 3 1st level spells before he runs out of spells, or some combination in between.)

Sounds tricky, but it isn't and it is very easy to run. My friends and their kids love the freedom they get in picking spells "on the fly" with this system.

[Treebore]

I have a house rule for spellcasting that works pretty well for me. It's basically a spell point system.

0) Ignore cantrips. Spellcasters can cast those "at will."
1) For a spellcaster, count up the total number of spells they can cast. (Example: 5/2/1 would be 3 because we ignore the 5 cantrips.)
2) For a spellcaster, count up the total number of spell levels they can cast. (Example: 5/2/1 would be 5*0 + 2*1 +1*2 = 4)
3) For a spellcaster, note the highest spell level he can cast. (Example: 5/2/1 would be 2nd level.)

So the spellcaster can cast any spells he likes as long as he doesn't violate my three rules above. (Example: no more than 3 spells totalling no more than 4 spell levels, none higher than 2nd level spells. So he could cast 2 2nd level spells before he runs out of spell levels, or 3 1st level spells before he runs out of spells, or some combination in between.)

Sounds tricky, but it isn't and it is very easy to run. My friends and their kids love the freedom they get in picking spells "on the fly" with this system.

Hmmm... that "cap" sounds like it will work for my SP system I want to try. Which would make sense, since mathematically, my new idea sounds like your old idea. Identical, once I use your "cap" idea.

[finarvyn]

I like it because there are really only three numbers to track; three key rules not to violate. It always sounds wonky when I type it, but runs very smoothly in practice.

[noratbs]

The magic house rules I've set up for my upcoming campaign are as follows:

Maximum Spell Level: Spellcasters may only learn spell levels up to 1/2 of their appropriate spellcasting attribute. Ex. A wizard with 12 INT may only learn spells up to lvl 6. She may try to cast a 7th level spell directly from a scroll with a SIEGE check, but cannot transfer the spell to her spellbook. A failure when casting a high level spell from a scroll requires a roll on the Non-caster scroll failure table (CKG p.50)

Bonus Cantrip Spells: For every bonus spell that a spellcaster receives, he also receives a bonus cantrip. So a 1st level wizard with a 16 INT would gain 1 extra cantrip slot along with 1 extra 1st level spell slot. The same wizard would then gain 1 extra cantrip slot along with 1 extra 2nd level spell slot at level 3.

Quick Charge: Spellcasters may temporarily sacrifice 1 point of CON, 1 point of CHA, & 1 point of INT (wizards, illusionists) or WIS (druids, clerics) in exchange for recovering all 1st level spells. Recovered spells are the spells the spellcaster memorized for that day. Casters may sacrifice like number of attribute points for spell levels. So 2 points sacrificed in each needed attribute would recover all 1st & 2nd level spells. The spell casting attribute may not be decreased below 10 at any time. Sacrificed points may be regained at 1 point per 1 full day of rest. Restoration spells cannot be used to restore the points, but Enhance attribute spells may be used to temporarily offset the loss. Paladins may not use this ability.

Daily Spell Lists: Wizards & illusionists will prepare a list of spells for each spell level that they may spontaneously cast. They may cast those spells in any combination as needed throughout the day, but may not use a spell slot from 1 level for a spell of a different level. A SIEGE check will be needed each time a spell is cast (CL based on spell level). Failure will require a roll on the non-caster scroll failure table.

Spell Memorization: Spellcasters need 8 hours uninterrupted sleep/rest to memorize spells.

Reading Scrolls: Wizards & illusionists do not use the read magic spell. Instead they gain the decipher script ability (CL to be determined).

Non-Caster Scroll Failure Table (Roll 1d8)
1 - Opposite Effect: Combat spells strike caster, Summoning spells teleport caster to summoned creature’s lair, Utility spells (fly, shield, etc) effect enemies
2 - Random Effect: Spell randomly replicates the abilities & effects of a spell of equal level.
3 - Spell Weakened: Spell is half its normal power or duration
4 - Spell Strengthened: Spell is double its normal power or duration
5 - Illusion: Spell apparently works, but it is, in fact, an illusion.
6-8 - Fizzle: Spell has no effect at all; the reading simply fails.

I liked the quick charge rules from the CKG because in a test-play one shot, the party's 3rd level wizard ran out of spells a third of the way through the dungeon. I ended up adding the daily spell list modification because several of my players voiced their hatred of pure Vancian magic, and I didn't want to adapt the entire DCC magic system that they were fans of.