Zagyg Reborn

[Julian Grimm]

After hearing about the history of C&C my players was wanting to see what I had of the Castle Zagyg material. This resulted in us using the setting for our last session and an interest in continuing in the area and on to the Castle. Along with this was an interest in building a world around the Eastmark using the few bits provided in the material. I have been rereading the material I have and making notes on how to run the next couple sessions.

The whole of this has turned into the idea of continuing CZ not only as a homage to the project but as a way of celebrating the 10th anniversary of C&C. Feeling that I am not the only one that would love to do something like this I thought I would open up the discussion on how we are continuing on with CZ, Yggsburgh and Urth to share ideas with others.

There are only a couple things I would not like to see in this thread: 1) We all know Castle of the Mad Archmage is out there and can substitute for the castle. I would not like to fall into that trap as I would rather to go with our own ideas and 2) Let's keep the Gygax Games bashing to a minimum. We all feel hosed and we know how well things have worked. There is no need to rehash that.

Other than that, let's see what we can drum up.

P.S. My blog also has some recent posts dealing with CZ and Yggsburgh.

[seskis281]

I was looking at Yggsburgh and the East Mark as a potential setting for my next C&C campaign later this year or early next year (we're still in progress on a FR campaign and my do a month or so Shadowrun in-between). While I ultimately decided to go instead with original Known World (Mystara) straight out of X1 and Cook Expert set, I did start thinking along the lines you are looking at...

I had thought that the "fog" of coverage would only have been removed from the portion of the castle we have, the Upper Works and Mouths of Madness, and thus the only part accessible to the adventurous. I actually was looking at the Lost Mine from the 5e set as being able to port into the area, with Yggsburgh replacing the FR cities (ps - after reading more I really like Lost Mine, but am very much less enthused with Hoard of the Dragon Queen - once you get into that one it REALLY is a railroad of an adventure, though I can mine parts of it).

One thing might be to take (if your players are unfamiliar with them) either a few of the early B mods or the early 3e mods (Sunless Citadel, Forge of Fury) and locate them in areas just outside the boundaries of the East Mark itself. A strong setup might be that the East Mark is becoming isolated from "civilized" lands, the Pike must be kept open, etc.

[TheMetal1]

I've got Yggsburgh and surroundings in my A-series campaign. The PCs have found items from there, seen notices posted from various merchants and guilds (Wizard's Guild) and had a caravan they were working for to get to Botkinburg, continued on to that location via Lundensheim, but decided (thankfully) to explore Blacktooth Ridge.

Here are the hooks that I've used.

1. A cask of very, very, very fine Cask of Brandy with the Maker's Mark indicating the Wizard's Guild.
2. A trunk that a necromancer used which when the lock was turned one way, it opened to a truck, when turned the other way, it led to set of stairs opening up to a Sky Castle. I used DA1 Dark Journey's as the layout of the floating castle. The trunk was taken up to Yggsburgh by Caravan Merchant, along with the necromancer's body.
3. Wizard's Guild adventurers wanted poster to assist with exploration.

I would like finish the Magician's Manse first before tackling the Upper Works, I'll likely include the necromancer, the trunk, or the necro's familiar - an imp as a hook (or all three)

Not sure what to use for the stuff below. But do like the plans that Trolls had for everything.

[Julian Grimm]

So far I have decided on going with the approach that Urth is an alternate Oerth and have used a couple elements from that to get things started. Outside of the East Mark map I am using a variation of Benoist's Dunfalcon map as the area just beyond the East Mark. (Link) As for beyond that I am looking closely at the North America idea of Gary's original campaign to get a feel for the rest of Urth.

For my castle I am changing the history up a bit and making Zagyg much more sinister and evil than mad and zany. The castle will show this as will the mansion (which I am rewriting a bit). The result is some very nasty things in the area that are being uncovered by sages and guilds. One thing that may come into play is that the mist may hold some connection to a certain demi-plane that we all know very well. Since I like to throw some Lovecraftian and classic horror ideas into my games this idea fits my CKing style and what I want to accomplish.

I am also looking at two different paths the party could take in this campaign. One is to explore the castle and the other would be to explore Zagyg's history. While I will go for a mixed approach I know my players pretty well and they will hop from one to the other. So I better be prepared for that.

[serleran]

I had hoped this would bring news of another sort.

But, any time the great Castle can be used, it is a welcome event.

Enjoy.

[Julian Grimm]

I took a lesson from the Canonfire! bunch. Even though the setting may be 'dead' there is no reason not to continue with it. I see no reason why the community couldn't work together to continue CZ in some form or another. While I do hope to see the project return I just don't see it happening any time soon. That leaves it to us to continue it.

[Zudrak]

Don't forget to mine the work of grodog (he of dragonsfoot and other older RPG sites around the interwebs) for Greyhawk lore and notes on the Castle.

I don't mean to say "just copy what he came up with," etc. but if you want to get The Green Man, The Bottle City, etc. into your game based on the legends put out there in the past as to what was contained IN the Castle, then grodog's research can help make a checklist of what you want to put into your version of the Castle. That's what I did a few years back (before CZ: Yggsburgh was even hinted at), using the old TSR module as a template but mostly as a map for me to fill with my own creations.

[serleran]

Grodog is, indeed, a font of Greyhawk goodness.

[Julian Grimm]

Love Grodog's work. I have used it before for a few things and it always worked well.

Now, here's a cool thing that happened yesterday. . .

My wife was looking at my notes; which were a list of minor alterations for Dark Chateau. She looked puzzled then asks, "Didn't someone burn the mansion down last year?" I asked her what she meant and she reminded me that a group that I was running the adventure for did set fire to the mansion burning it to the ground leaving just the grounds and dungeon levels. She also asked me what else had happened before so I told her what I could remember.

She responds with, "I would pick it up from there. Let a few years pass with little activity in the area and then the players come in after the earlier games happened." I knew what she was saying. Basically she was telling me not to reset things and continue from the point that the last Zagyg games left off. Giving this a sense of continuity. It was perfect.

So, that is what I am going to do. Let things pick up with what other players have already done so that there is a feel of this being an ongoing campaign. I told her this was perfect then remembered something. The conversation ended with me asking her, "Wasn't that you that set the mansion on fire?"

[Zudrak]

Love Grodog's work. I have used it before for a few things and it always worked well.

Now, here's a cool thing that happened yesterday. . .

My wife was looking at my notes; which were a list of minor alterations for Dark Chateau. She looked puzzled then asks, "Didn't someone burn the mansion down last year?" I asked her what she meant and she reminded me that a group that I was running the adventure for did set fire to the mansion burning it to the ground leaving just the grounds and dungeon levels. She also asked me what else had happened before so I told her what I could remember.

She responds with, "I would pick it up from there. Let a few years pass with little activity in the area and then the players come in after the earlier games happened." I knew what she was saying. Basically she was telling me not to reset things and continue from the point that the last Zagyg games left off. Giving this a sense of continuity. It was perfect.

So, that is what I am going to do. Let things pick up with what other players have already done so that there is a feel of this being an ongoing campaign. I told her this was perfect then remembered something. The conversation ended with me asking her, "Wasn't that you that set the mansion on fire?"

Haha! Great stuff, Julian. I agree -- make the Castle (and Mansion) your own by continuing from YOUR past. That's what Greyhawk was supposed to be in the first place. A skeletal outline for the gamers to "fill out."

[Zudrak]

Grodog is, indeed, a font of Greyhawk goodness.

Indeed! I had the privilege of playing at his parents' house the past two summers as he hosted his own Castle Greyhawk level using AD&D 1e. He grew up just 1 block from my aunt/uncle/cousins, so it was a real treat being able to play in August of 2013 and again this past June. The June game featured my son and Grodog's two boys along with yours truly and a fifth player. The August 2013 game was more numerous with about 8 players there. I had a blast both times but especially the second because of sharing the experience of AD&D and Castle Greyhawk with my 11 year old son.

[Warunsun]

The sad thing is that the Zagyg series was never completed. At the time that the books were in print I was unaware of them. I was even running a campaign set in the famous Greyhawk dungeon at the time the books were out. I just never heard of them. Now folks want a fortune for them online and it just isn't worth it for 1/3 of the dungeon. Money is tight right now but I would be willing to spend a bit if more of it was out there. I am sure this was an awesome set. I do have several versions of the Castle in print so maybe I am lucky I am not compelled to spend it on this. I am sure there are reasons this would never come back into print but if it did I would be willing to buy it from the Troll Lords.

[Julian Grimm]

The sad thing is that the Zagyg series was never completed. At the time that the books were in print I was unaware of them. I was even running a campaign set in the famous Greyhawk dungeon at the time the books were out. I just never heard of them. Now folks want a fortune for them online and it just isn't worth it for 1/3 of the dungeon. Money is tight right now but I would be willing to spend a bit if more of it was out there. I am sure this was an awesome set. I do have several versions of the Castle in print so maybe I am lucky I am not compelled to spend it on this. I am sure there are reasons this would never come back into print but if it did I would be willing to buy it from the Troll Lords.

I feel your pain. I remember saving up for the Upper Works when it was released just to get close and have the whole thing come crashing down. However, I do still have my copy of Yggsburgh and the East Mark and they can still be used in my campaign. Interestingly enough, I have also looking at my copy of Epic of Aerth and am almost ready to place Yggsburgh there.

One things about this post made me reply. As I was reading it I was wondering what it would take (and the legal feasibility of) to make a free clone of Yggsburgh or a Yggsburgh like setting. I am sure it would be doable but would have to be carefully. Hell, if you can get Castle of the Mad Archmage out without issue this could be done.

[Lord Dynel]

I had hoped this would bring news of another sort.

But, any time the great Castle can be used, it is a welcome event.

Enjoy.

Ditto.

I like the map, Benoist did, and I appreciate the effort, but I' personally would leave Yggsburgh out of Greyhawk and have it as it's own mini-setting. There's a lot there to have a setting all its own. I guess if one is trying to fit it in an existing campaign, I can see the point.

[Julian Grimm]

I had hoped this would bring news of another sort.

But, any time the great Castle can be used, it is a welcome event.

Enjoy.

Ditto.

I like the map, Benoist did, and I appreciate the effort, but I' personally would leave Yggsburgh out of Greyhawk and have it as it's own mini-setting. There's a lot there to have a setting all its own. I guess if one is trying to fit it in an existing campaign, I can see the point.

I agree with you and as this has evolved I have moved away from Greyhawk and am looking at other options. As I said above I have been looking at the Epic of Aerth as an idea as well as building a world around it. I like the idea of a mythical Earth of some sort and with the codex series going strong that looks like a possibility.