Should the `rogue' be renamed `thief'?

Fizz · Post by **Fizz** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 7:06 pm

I've seen several posts lately where people say something like this:

"So, about that thief, er, i mean rogue..."

Let's face it. They're thieves. Call them such. Put it in the 4th printing.
-Fizz

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 7:09 pm

I never quit calling them thieves. Not only because I think you should call them what they are meant to do, but it also tended to irritate irritating people.
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Post by **Breakdaddy** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 7:26 pm

I voted who the heck cares. Mainly because Ill call em whatever I want anyway, so It doesnt matter what the authors think I should call em!

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 7:27 pm

I interchage the terms so much now days, that it actually doesn't matter to me at all what the class name is.

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Mike Frank · Post by **Mike Frank** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 7:30 pm

Treebore wrote:
I never quit calling them thieves. Not only because I think you should call them what they are meant to do, but it also tended to irritate irritating people.

Same here. Doesn't really matter what the book says. I've always called them thieves.

jman5000 · Post by **jman5000** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 7:41 pm

I call them roughish rapscallions, and to hell with all you monosyllabic 'old skoolers'

Cheers,

J.

serleran · Post by **serleran** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 7:49 pm

There were, I believe, some issues avoided by calling them rogues...

Turanil · Post by **Turanil** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 8:16 pm

I am okay with "rogue" except when some people call them "rouge" instead.

Otherwise, I now prefer "rogue" because I have houserule them into three sub-types: acrobat, blade, and thief.
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Fizz · Post by **Fizz** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 8:21 pm

Turanil wrote:
I am okay with "rogue" except when some people call them "rouge" instead.

Yeah, but i get annoyed when people call them `theif'. Heh.

Quote:
Otherwise, I now prefer "rogue" because I have houserule them into three sub-types: acrobat, blade, and thief.

Hmmm, i made acrobat into its own class. What's a blade?

-Fizz

slimykuotoan · Post by **slimykuotoan** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 8:22 pm

I don't mind 'rogue'; I don't find 'thief' encompases enough.

cleaverthepit · Post by **cleaverthepit** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 8:33 pm

Guess which way I vetod

Storm Queen · Post by **Storm Queen** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 8:40 pm

Rogue is a much cooler term than thief. To me, rogue implies a whole range of character types: ne'er do wells, swashbucklers, Han Solo-esque smugglers and scoundrels. Thieves just sound as though they nick things.
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Fizz · Post by **Fizz** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 9:01 pm

Storm Queen wrote:
swashbucklers, Han Solo-esque smugglers and scoundrels. Thieves just sound as though they nick things.

Ey- rogue just means someone who gets into trouble- sounds like all adventurers. Heh. And smugglers are thieves. Han Solo was a thief!
-Fizz

Tadhg · Post by **Tadhg** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 9:12 pm

Quote:
No, and it would be criminal to do so

Heh, speaking of criminal types, eh?

I like the broader class name "rogue", as a lock picking and trap springing specialist, he may never steal or pick a pocket. So why call him a thief? But I do like to have thieves and pick pockets and treasure hunting lock/trap specialists, etc.

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serleran · Post by **serleran** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 9:26 pm

I like horse-thief, itinerant, cutpurse... I like all the terms that describe roguish activities, but as a description for the archetype: I prefer "criminal."

Gleemax Jr · Post by **Gleemax Jr** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 9:48 pm

We prefer the word thief because it applies only to those who commit crimes. The word rogue applies to anyone not catering to societal or cultural demands, like a "rogue scientist" or a "rogue ninja." One is a noun, the other an adjective.

andakitty · Post by **andakitty** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 10:47 pm

Thief is just a fantasy staple. As in 'Thief of Baghdad'. It doesn't really matter to me, all the PCs tend to be thieves anyway.

Fizz · Post by **Fizz** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 10:55 pm

Rhuvein wrote:
Heh, speaking of criminal types, eh?

Finally! Somebody got that!
-Fizz

jman5000 · Post by **jman5000** » Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:40 pm

cleaverthepit wrote:
Guess which way I vetod

there was no drunken strip club patron option, so, Davis, I give up???

Cheers,

J

cleaverthepit · Post by **cleaverthepit** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 12:23 am

can we call the cleric "healer"

the druid "hippie"

the fighter "obnoxious"

the paladin a "goodie two shoes"

:0 :/ :] :} :c :\ :> :<

moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 1:44 am

A Thief is always a Rogue... but a Rogue is not always a Thief.

This has always been a favorite archetype of mine to play... but while some of them were thieves, not all of them were.

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gideon_thorne · Post by **gideon_thorne** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 1:45 am

cleaverthepit wrote:
can we call the cleric "healer"

The cleric got replaced by the Healer class in my game. ^_~`
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Dyne · Post by **Dyne** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 3:20 am

I think rogue is more general and basic, and it can refer to a wider variety to character types (similar to Fighter or Warrior). Though I wouldn't really care whether they were called rogues or thieves, as long as it's spelled right.

gideon_thorne wrote:
The cleric got replaced by the Healer class in my game. ^_~`

WotC actually created a Healer class in the so-called "Miniatures Handbook". It was basically a crappier version of a cleric, I believe.

gideon_thorne · Post by **gideon_thorne** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 3:36 am

Dyne wrote:
WotC actually created a Healer class in the so-called "Miniatures Handbook". It was basically a crappier version of a cleric, I believe.

*smiles* They didn't create one like I did.

^_^

There was no logical reason in my game for a 'knights templar' style warrior of faith, so I ditched the concept and created something a fair sight more appropriate.

Ive only seen two instances of something like my Healer class. In an old star trek episode featuring a mute empath and in a book called Caverns of Socrates
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JRR · Post by **JRR** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 5:37 am

serleran wrote:
There were, I believe, some issues avoided by calling them rogues...

Could you elaborate? I don't believe you can copyright the word "thief." It would be like copyrighting lawyer or librarian or shoplifter.
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Turanil · Post by **Turanil** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 5:47 am

Fizz wrote:
Hmmm, i made acrobat into its own class. What's a blade?

My subtypes: as Rogue with additional abilities:

-- Acrobat: get the Acrobatic skill as per the True20 ruleset.

-- Blade: get +1 bonus to AC and Weapon Finesse as per d20.

-- Thief: get the Appraise skill and an affilation to their home city's thieves' guild.
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SavageRobby · Post by **SavageRobby** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 10:58 am

I always call them a thief, cuz thats what I'm used to. I'd be nice to see them called a thief officially, but "no biggie" sums it up perfectly. I'll keep calling them thieves.

3rd Eye · Post by **3rd Eye** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 11:16 am

JRR wrote:
Could you elaborate? I don't believe you can copyright the word "thief." It would be like copyrighting lawyer or librarian or shoplifter.

I doubt it was a copyright issue. I think it's more likely to have been a perceived morality issue Concerned Citizens might wet their diapers over a clearly criminal title like "Thief," while "Rogue" sounds dashing and romantic.

Post by **Fiffergrund** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 11:44 am

I want a "mendicant" class so I can play Groo.
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serleran · Post by **serleran** » Fri Aug 24, 2007 1:06 pm

It has nothing to do with copyright, and more to do with certain terms of the OGL, I believe, as in, using certain terms. But, like I said, I really don't know if its true or not... but I did hear that at one point.