I'm in shock.

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 8:16 am

I was at my LGS today, you know, the one I keep mentioning being 54 miles away?

I asked the owner what was happening on November 3rd, for the international game day being pushed by WOTC.

He said nothing. Evne though there are lots of people around who game a lot, none were interested in running anything. Apparently that caught me very off guard, because before I knew it my mouth was saying, "I could run something for you. My only hang up is that I live an hour away."

So I immediately become stunned that my mouth said such a thing.

He then asks something like, "Well, I don't have time to talk right now, can you come in later this week and work this out?"

My stunned brain allows my mouth to say, "I have to come back into town Monday for a Doctors appointment."

"Perfect! Monday is the slowest day of the week for me."

My autonomous mouth asks, "When do you open? My appointment is at 10 AM."

He tells me 11:30.

My brain is still numb with shock.

"OK, I might have to wait an hour or so, but I can be here Monday."

"Great! See you then, I gotta get back to my customers."

Which he did. His annual 50% off sale on EVERYTHING in his store was today. So he was busy even this evening with about a dozen people playing magic and something that looked like a sci fi version of Warhammer miniatures gaming and anothe rhalf dozen ro so people looking over the shelves for something they wanted to buy at half off.

fortunately for me I had decided to stop by and see if any of my wife's Anita Blake comics were in our pull box. So I ended up getting 50% off on a half dozen gaming items I had been wishing I could afford to buy. At 50% off you tend to force yourself to be able to afford it.

Anyways, for the first time in over 2 years I will be DMing 3E.

I still can't believe what my mouth got me into.

Hopefully I will end up glad it did.
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Rigon · Post by **Rigon** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 9:08 am

You should see if he'll let you run C&C instead. No need to burden yourself with 3e.

R-
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CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 11:03 am

1. review a Rules Compendium (if available)

2. go over any spells you think sound if-y

3. if a player doesn't call an AoO, don't give them one

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Barrataria · Post by **Barrataria** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 11:38 am

Rigon wrote:
You should see if he'll let you run C&C instead. No need to burden yourself with 3e.

R-

Or just show up with two little C&C books and run it!
BB

CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 11:40 am

Barrataria wrote:
Or just show up with two little C&C books and run it!
BB

Treebore, I'm afraid you've been double dared.
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Witterquick · Post by **Witterquick** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 11:43 am

Treebore wrote:
So he was busy even this evening with about a dozen people playing magic and something that looked like a sci fi version of Warhammer miniatures gaming and anothe rhalf dozen ro so people looking over the shelves for something they wanted to buy at half off.

Anyways, for the first time in over 2 years I will be DMing 3E.

That'd probably be Warhammer 40K.

Well, it could be worse, you could've volunteered to poach endangered animals or something.
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grubman · Post by **grubman** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 12:26 pm

A one shot of D&D isnt difficult to runits when you play week after week that it becomes such a burden. Massive stat blocks just take too long to write and remember along with all the other prep. IMHO, there is nothing wrong with 3.X (please, dont get me started on 4E changes, it doesnt end well)if you have the time and patience to manage it.

I think you will enjoy it Treebore, if nothing else, as a change of pace. Hell, I have yet to see anyone who constantly plays the same game. Even publishers/writers play other peoples stuff on occasion. Shane Lacy Hensley always tells me he plays other games than Savage Worlds, and even Davis admitted on the RPGnet boards that he likes Rolemaster a lot. You are not committing an unforgivable sin by playing 3.Xand you certainly arent committing one if you enjoy it.

If you are bound and determined to pimp C&C I would prepare the adventure in both systems and present the option to the players, and explain the fundamental differences between the two games. Show them their characters. They might want to give C&C a try because it is something new, or if they are newbies they might find the character sheet and rules to look much more friendly.

I certainly wouldnt pull the old switcharoo. If people came to play D&D they might be most upset if you tell them when they sit down that you are playing something else.

MHO

CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 1:06 pm

grubman wrote:
I certainly wouldnt pull the old switcharoo. If people came to play D&D they might be most upset if you tell them when they sit down that you are playing something else.

MHO

Run a DCC like the Dragonfiend Pact ($2).

I just want to hear the reaction if someone mentions another game. Too many gamers I have spoken to before knew of D&D, and that was it.

I got a co-worker into RIFTS just by telling him about the system. And I don't even play RIFTS anymore, so it wasn't like I was out to convert him or anything. I just basically said something along the lines of "combat goes like this and character generation goes like that." Next thing you know he went out and started a game in it.
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Barrataria · Post by **Barrataria** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 2:54 pm

CharlieRock wrote:
Run a DCC like the Dragonfiend Pact ($2).

Good idea... also use the Goodman DCC character sheets. I forget what they appeared in (maybe the level 1-3 hardcover) but you can get it here:http://www.goodman-games.com/downloads/ ... itable.pdf

That sheet ALMOST tempted me to play 3E...

BB

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 3:00 pm

Tell 'em you forgot your v3.5 but brought your C&C. Switch it up.

-O
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grubman · Post by **grubman** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 3:07 pm

Omote wrote:
Tell 'em you forgot your v3.5 but brought your C&C. Switch it up.

-O

Do we really have to trick people into giving the game a shot? I mean, if Treebore tells them the difference, and what to expect and they aren't interested, it's better to just play D&D and have a good time.

I think (although I can't speak for him) Treebore honestly had promoting the hobby itself in mind when he offered to run a game...not some "political" agenda. People have to be interested in role playing before they can decide what they like and dont like.

MHO

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 3:16 pm

Yes. Yes he should. Just like 3rd edition tricked us that it was D&D. Treebore should trick them right back.

............................................Omote

FPQ
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gideon_thorne · Post by **gideon_thorne** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 3:34 pm

Actually gents, what ought to be done is to bring the 3.5 stuff in, and run that for 4 hours, and then break out the C&C stuff and run that in another 4 hour slot.

Treebore does not have to be the only one there running a game. He can bring the young folk, one of which I have heard high praise about as a CK, and have them run a C&C game.

Even if its in the same time slot you have two systems being run side by side that show case different approaches for differing tastes.

This way, its not disingenuous, its pushing two products that a 'neutral' party, aka the game shop, can sell, and its showing that fans of our game aren't insular as to what they are willing to promote.
It doesn't have to be an 'us against them', good or bad, or adversarial mentality.

There's room for every taste in this hobby. Xenophobic fanboy attitudes notwithstanding.
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moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 3:39 pm

You could also always run one of the older d20 Modules TLG did for Erde! That way TLG gets exposure from a different angle on a Campaign Setting that continues to be supported for C&C.

Moriarty the Red
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gideon_thorne · Post by **gideon_thorne** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 4:03 pm

moriarty777 wrote:
You could also always run one of the older d20 Modules TLG did for Erde! That way TLG gets exposure from a different angle on a Campaign Setting that continues to be supported for C&C.

Moriarty the Red

Also a very smart idea. Well done.
*smiles* In fact, the C&C and d20 versions of the module can be used to run both games.
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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 4:42 pm

Monday is when I find out the particulars. If I understood things I read on ENWorld about the game day WOTC sent out specific stuff to be run and used on November 3rd.

If things are left open for me to decide then I'll look into using a TLG module. Probably take the ones that are both C&C and D20, and run it from the C&C version. When they ask why I'll tell them how its easier to find things, that I only have the D20 version when I need to know what feats or skills they have, and how in C&C feats are just a SIEGE check and skills are assumed, etc... SO its just so much easier and faster with C&C.

Anyways, we'll see. Despite the opinion of apparently many people on other messageboards I don't hate 3E, I just much prefer not to DM it. Like one of you posted earlier in this thread, running a one shot isn't what kills you, its the long term campaign prepping.

I would also guess that the game day stuff is first level too. So that makes it even easier.

I'll also definitely take Charlie Rocks advice about AoO's.
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tacojohn4547 · Post by **tacojohn4547** » Sun Oct 28, 2007 10:40 pm

This whole thread makes me laugh, Treebore. LOL

I did almost the same thing recently for a local RPG group gameday that was coming up. I hadn't committed to running a game using a specific D&D game system, only that I'd run a game of D&D. Of course, I wasn't going to run anything in 3.x, but that hadn't come up.

Fortunately for me, the guy doing the planning for the gameday got his dates confused and had it scheduled for World Wide D&D day. After he realized his blunder, he unscheduled the gameday so it wouldn't fall on the same date.

Buda bing, buda boom...tacojohn is off the hook and free to game with my regular group. Whew!!!
tacojohn4547

CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 12:53 am

Barrataria wrote:
Good idea... also use the Goodman DCC character sheets. I forget what they appeared in (maybe the level 1-3 hardcover) but you can get it here:http://www.goodman-games.com/downloads/ ... itable.pdf

That sheet ALMOST tempted me to play 3E...

BB

Those sheets appeared in DCC#19 The Volcano Caves

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Post by **Breakdaddy** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:20 pm

I would *LOVE* to run an E6 game of D&D 3e. That mod looks very cool and I would absolutely run it anytime.

moriarty777 · Post by **moriarty777** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 2:50 pm

Breakdaddy wrote:
I would *LOVE* to run an E6 game of D&D 3e. That mod looks very cool and I would absolutely run it anytime.

I really like E6 ... if I ever end up running some 3.5 again... it will be using the E6 rules!

M
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Orpheus · Post by **Orpheus** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 3:28 pm

I've got a game set up for the 3rd (C&C home game), but it just happens to be pure coincidence as the game was originally scheduled for October 20th...then the 27th....then the 3rd. I had too many "Oh wait, I've got something to do"'s. Those usually involve the player's wife deciding that there was something important to plan for that day, or something which had been planned and then not mentioned to said player (or forgotten by said player as is usually the case). I'm married so I'm totally forgiving, but I've got a solid commitment from three of the six players and a baby due in about two weeks so I needs to game now! Two newcomers to rpg'ing and one grizzled AD&D veteran so it should be good. I've noticed that a couple of local FLGS's have events going on that day so I might stop by and see what the hububb is, but I'll be celebrating the day with C&C.

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Mon Oct 29, 2007 8:27 pm

Well, got the stuff. Its four mods for the "living" games, but they won't be sanctioned.

They are Living Greyhawks "Ambitions Folly" and "Trial by Fire", and Eberron's "Things Fall Apart" and "Marked MAn".

We are slotted (we being my daughter and I) for two time slots, 1 PM and then 5 PM.

Now to see how many show up.
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DangerDwarf · Post by **DangerDwarf** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 6:25 pm

My group is currently trying to convince me to run a 3e Dragonlance game when our current game runs down. They aren't huge 3e fans, they just really like the Dragonlance books put out by MWP/SP and want to try some of the stuff in them.

I'm presently torn between my dislike of 3e and my general inclination to give them the type of game they want. Bah. Damn you MWP/SP for putting out quality d20 books.

We're currently playing a Savage Worlds Dragonlance game, which is going really well but all their looking through the d20 books has got them going.

Maybe they'll give it up by the time we finish.

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 7:17 pm

The MW Races of Ansalon (d20) book is particularly good IMO. Really makes me want to run some d20 DL. Really, although there are some errors here and there, the d20 Dragonlance line is really, really good. It's too bad the authors had to embrace so fervently the v3.5 methodology.

-O
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DangerDwarf · Post by **DangerDwarf** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 7:29 pm

Yeah, the d20 Dragonlance stuff is completely top notch.

Prestige Classes are one of my big gripes about d20. The original purpose of them was absolute awesome, however what they became (abused power ups) sucked out loud. However, the Dragonlance d20 stuff does PrC's right. Several pages of fluff and then some game stats. Sweet,sweet stuff.

If I do end up running d20 for them, MWP's stuff is probably the only way to talk me into it.

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 8:50 pm

Maybe you should try, if you haven't already, allowing all feats, and just require a SIEGE check to pull off the "maneuver". Then use the PRC's as your levels above 8th (replaces any class abilities they may get, so mine have opted to wait until after achieving 9th level, but the Paladin wasn't willing to wait until 12th) and just give them those powers as they level.

Works pretty good, even my online players seem to like it a good bit.

So you get the 3E feat flavor, but since no one likes rolling tons of dice, they only try those feats when they feel they really need to.
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DangerDwarf · Post by **DangerDwarf** » Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:32 pm

Feats and PrC's are some of the things that drove me away from d20. So, I'm not really looking to add them to C&C. To me, it would limit the system by still encouraging the players to look at feats and attempting to use them instead of using their own ideas and actions. Sure, they have the freedom of using all of the feats, but they are still limited by the same feats.

The SIEGE engine is great for thinking outside the box. Using d20 feats keeps them in the box,albeit a much bigger box, but still inside the box.

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:05 am

Its all in presentation.

My players don't look up feats. They just say, "Can I roll for an extra attack like "x feat" would allow me to have?"

Lately they haven't even been referring to feats, they just say "Can I roll to attempt X?"

Still, depends on what your players are like.
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Jungger · Post by **Jungger** » Wed Oct 31, 2007 12:21 am

As long as you're having fun and not hurting anyone, it doesn't matter what people think.

On that note, I hope you have fun with the game and kill all your players without allowing saves.

Troll Lord Games

I'm in shock.

I'm in shock.

Re: I'm in shock.