Making gnomes more unique.

wolfpunk · Post by **wolfpunk** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 1:06 am

Several of the pictures of gnomes in the Players Handbook and the picture of them in the Monsters and Treasure book imply to me that gnomes have more animalistic features.

So I started looking for different types of burrowing creatures for gnomes to borrow features from. I decided that I would may gnomes be slightly different based upon which animal they take after.

This is what I came up with.

Badger: The badger gnome has no attribute modifiers.

Rabbit: The rabbit gnome has +1 dex but -1 str.

Mole: The mole gnome has +1 con but -1 str.

Fox: The fox is the standard gnome as presented in the Players Handbook.

Burrowing Owl: The owl gnome has +1 wis -1 str and darkvision 90 ft.

River Otter: The otter gnome has +1 cha -1 str and a swim speed equal to their land speed.

Obviously, any type of burrowing mammal could be used. Things like ants, spiders, meerkats, snakes could easily be made to work.

serleran · Post by **serleran** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 5:05 am

Almost submitted something like this for the CKG, but then decided it just keeps the gnome as a "burrowing friend" and doesn't take the race in a difference direction, so, I thought of something else. Related, but not the same. Nice idea, though, and easy to do.

At least there are other people who like gnomes.

pactmaster · Post by **pactmaster** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 2:07 am

My C&C gnomes look like normal gnomes, some of those C&C rascals look too much like goblins. But I do have hill, forest and meadow gnomes with their own traits.
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Camazotz · Post by **Camazotz** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:04 pm

Gnomes are important little people in my campaign, as they are the only "little people" around. I devised a race called the syleni (after the Greek god Sylenus) to encompass halflings for my players who absolutely cannot live without playing their halfling characters, but my gnomes are the stars. They break down like this:

Forest gnomes - dwelling in hollow trees and hills, these gnomes are classic scandinavian red-cap wearing gnomes.

Deep gnomes - based on the Norse dock'alfar. Unpleasant runts.

City gnomes - these gnomes have adapted to city dwelling. They are technically derivative of the old idea of Roman household gods and spirits, to whom offers are made to appease. Nonetheless, they are real little folk who dwell in the neighborhood, and popular local supersition is that they are good luck to have around.

Finally, in my other campaign, gnomes are fastidious scholars and keepers of lore. They are spread throughout human lands, but have no realm of their own. The mythology behind gnomes suggest that they were once a sacred race of lorekeepers for the mechanisms of the gods, and (in this campaign) have become a diaspora after the apocalypse.

ironbull · Post by **ironbull** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:26 pm

Camazotz, thanks for sharing that.
I never used gnomes in any of my campaigns. Never had a player want to play one. Never could figure out a good way to make them "fit" in my campaign world.

Your short description has given inspiration to me for some ideas for the little buggers. I need to do some thinking/writing, but I may be able to include these little guys after all!
thanks!

Eisenmann · Post by **Eisenmann** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 1:36 am

One of the best games for me ever was a one-on-one game where the PC played a gnome named Gyp.

It was set up as the typical goblins/orcs/wargs attack a town and the PC had to make his way through the chaos and eventually rescue the town's mayor from an orc underground lair.

It was beautiful in how the PC would use wit, wile and illusions where typical adventurers would rely on brawn and violence.

DangerDwarf · Post by **DangerDwarf** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 2:29 am

I found a use for gnomes in my game too.

Sorry. Couldn't resist.
I do like your idea though. Makes gnomes more interesting and less puntable.

phadeout · Post by **phadeout** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:33 pm

Well, I've always loved gnomes. I used to play only in FR games (1st and 2nd edition). I always found gnomes were very much life little dwarves that lived in the forested hills. But I just always loved them. I think the only thing they really had going for them was their Illusionist specialties, and their "different" multi-class options for 2nd Edition (my longest running character of all time is a Cleric/Thief Gnome - also a class no one else could ever take IIRC). They also had Cleric/Illusionist which was great.

Overall, I find the most interesting gnomes to be Tinker gnomes. FR never really had them, but with 2nd edition they made gnomes able to be specialty priests of Gone (god of invention). Due to this, you kinda had Tinker gnomes in FR, and they were great.

My favorite was to split up gnomes as follows:

Tinker Gnomes (just plain fun, also unique if you make them the only ones in the campaign world that have access to making Greek (gnomish) Fire, Smoke Bombs, Blackpowder and other basic inventions - extremely fun times!)

Forest Gnomes (extremely tiny player race, see 2nd Ed stats)

Deep Gnomes (earth based/illusion based gnomes)
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CharlieRock · Post by **CharlieRock** » Fri Jan 11, 2008 4:49 pm

I like gnomes in C&C the way they look. It's pretty neat.
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Kos · Post by **Kos** » Mon Jan 28, 2008 9:53 pm

What's with all the gnome hate? Who dosn't like magical wee folk? Who among us can say he's never wanted to be tiny magical man? I know I can't.

Harry Joy · Post by **Harry Joy** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 1:15 am

Kos wrote:
What's with all the gnome hate? Who dosn't like magical wee folk? Who among us can say he's never wanted to be tiny magical man? I know I can't.

If you run across any serious Gnome hatred, please call it to my attention. This thread wavered for a bit on that football picture, but I do believe the poster was joking. But, it's always best to be careful.

Again, if you see anything that needs to be addressed and possibly corrected, please send an urgent message to me, or my compatriots.
The Western Tennessee Gnome Liberation League

Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 3:35 am

Gond. Not Gone. Gond.
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Kos · Post by **Kos** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 5:52 am

Power to the little people!

Saarlander · Post by **Saarlander** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 10:32 am

Hail +1 for the Gnomes !

Especially since C&C reconciliated me with those (always had the the lame DMs just not knowing what to do with them, so we basically only ever saw sort of "under-dwarves" in them).

At last we have a third Elder Race along Elves and Dwarves!

Now that i'm planning to run a C&C campaign soon, i will definitely have some (at least as valuable NPCs), and one of my Gnome-allergic regular players changed his mind too yesterday, after hearing about the C&C version of them !

Burrowing Fairy-Folk are great !
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gideon_thorne · Post by **gideon_thorne** » Tue Jan 29, 2008 4:12 pm

I was pushing for a more earth elemental type of gnome, but the concept got whittled down.
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BLOOD AXE · Post by **BLOOD AXE** » Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:47 am

Seriously. Im not a fan of Gnomes. Out of years of playing RPGs I've only seen a player choose a Gnome one time. To me, they come off as half-Dwarf, half-Halfling (quarterling? ). A cross betwen the two that never really works out.

Now there is that Travelocity garden Gnome.....

Lucifer_Draconus · Post by **Lucifer_Draconus** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 9:13 pm

phadeout wrote:
My favorite was to split up gnomes as follows:

Tinker Gnomes (just plain fun, also unique if you make them the only ones in the campaign world that have access to making Greek (gnomish) Fire, Smoke Bombs, Blackpowder and other basic inventions - extremely fun times!)

The Gnomes in the world I'm making are similar to this.Dwarves are twisted n' Evil corrupted Gnomes who use magic.

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csperkins1970 · Post by **csperkins1970** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 11:03 pm

I dig gnomes but have only only played 1 gnome in all of my years of playing D&D/C&C (he was an illusionist/thief in AD&D and got ported over into C&C... until he quickly snuffed it).

That said, I like plain old 1st edition gnomes. I've always describe them as a cross between dwarves and brownies in games I run...
Kin to dwarves, gnomes are noticeably smaller than their distant cousins, averaging just over 3 in height. Gnomes, as they proudly maintain, are also less rotund than dwarves, weighing between 55 and 70 pounds. Their noses, however, are significantly larger. Most gnomes have dark tan or wood brown skin and white hair. Their eyes are grey-blue to bright blue. A typical gnome lives for over 600 years.

Gnomes have lively and sly senses of humor, especially for practical jokes. They have a great love of living things and finely wrought items, particularly gems and jewelry. Gnomes love all sorts of precious stones and are masters of gem polishing and cutting.

Gnomes prefer to live in areas of rolling, rocky hills, well wooded and uninhabited by humans. Their diminutive stature has made them suspicious of the larger races humans and elvesalthough they are not hostile. They are sly and furtive with those they do not know or trust, and somewhat reserved even under the best of circumstances. Dwelling in mines and burrows, they are sympathetic to dwarves, but find their cousins aversion to surface dwellers foolish.

Buttmonkey · Post by **Buttmonkey** » Tue Feb 12, 2008 11:13 pm

Kos wrote:
What's with all the gnome hate? Who dosn't like magical wee folk? Who among us can say he's never wanted to be tiny magical man? I know I can't.

What's not to like about gnome-hating? In my C&C chat game last weekend, I played a NG dwarf cleric. After the gnome wizard got knocked unconscious, I carried him back to town and then volunteered his cash to pay for our room and meals at the inn overnight until I got a cure light wounds spell back. When I revived the gnome, I told him he had been robbed by a goblin while he was unconscious.
After we went back to the dungeon, the gnome's player had to leave the game suddenly. Before leaving, the player said his PC would have no problem walking past some arrow slits in the walls of the corridor (we were worried goblin archers were waiting to nail us). After the gnome player left, we had a short but serious discussion about whether we should chuck the gnome down the hall to draw any fire from ambushing goblins.

Good times.

Tadhg · Post by **Tadhg** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 12:18 am

Buttmonkey wrote:
After the gnome player left, we had a short but serious discussion about whether we should chuck the gnome down the hall to draw any fire from ambushing goblins.

Good times.

OK, that's it. You've gone too far!!
"Gnome chucking"????
That is seriously funny!!
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Dragonhelm · Post by **Dragonhelm** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 5:02 am

Mark me down for tinker gnomes. I love the flavor, and it gives them a distinctive role in the world.

WotC, on the other hand, can't figure out what it is supposed to be and has booted them from the 4e PHB.
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serleran · Post by **serleran** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 5:07 am

I kinda liked my Doldrum gnomes.

Aladar · Post by **Aladar** » Wed Feb 13, 2008 7:54 pm

I always liked the G'home Gnomes from Terry Brooks' Landover series of books. Talk about your gnome thieves.
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Harry Joy · Post by **Harry Joy** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 1:57 am

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1811

csperkins1970 · Post by **csperkins1970** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 2:05 am

Harry Joy wrote:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1811

Sweet Jesus, I think I just suffered 2d6 Sanity loss!

Harry Joy · Post by **Harry Joy** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 2:34 am

csperkins1970 wrote:
Sweet Jesus, I think I just suffered 2d6 Sanity loss!

But he sure is unique, ain't he?

Turanil · Post by **Turanil** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 4:04 pm

He is the living proof that gnomes' strength should be capped at 10 maximum (and in fact 8 or 7 would be even more appropriate). But go and try to tell your player who wanted to make a gnome fighter that he cannot have a 17 strength...
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jeff · Post by **jeff** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 6:56 pm

Turanil wrote:
He is the living proof that gnomes' strength should be capped at 10 maximum (and in fact 8 or 7 would be even more appropriate). But go and try to tell your player who wanted to make a gnome fighter that he cannot have a 17 strength...

Hey! Gnome fighters are the best!! After all, if there's ever a rumble, there's no race like Gnomes!

pactmaster · Post by **pactmaster** » Thu Feb 14, 2008 10:44 pm

While that link was disturbing, I stumbled on one from that same page about the poor woman in the super hero costume that popped out during a signing. In the picture shown (don't look if a nipple offends you or if you are too young to legally view one yet), one would think that you would notice something like that sticking out about a foot from your face. She seems very relaxed and unconcerned while posing.

And now back to the gnome conversation......
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Harry Joy · Post by **Harry Joy** » Fri Feb 15, 2008 1:41 am

jeff wrote:
Hey! Gnome fighters are the best!! After all, if there's ever a rumble, there's no race like Gnomes!

Sweet Jesus, I think I just suffered 2d6 Sanity loss!