D&D 4e Darksun, C&C conversion?

Sir Ironside · Post by **Sir Ironside** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 12:32 am

With the advent of the new D&D 4e rules, and there awesome announcement that their next world is going to be Dark Sun- plus the difficulty I have converting systems when I don't have the rules for either of them. I'll leave it to the good people at the TLG forums.

Just how easy do you think one could convert the New Darksun from 4e to C&C?

This is my third favourite setting so if conversion is easy, I'd take a hard look at it. I'm not a whole lot interested in getting the 2e D&D books, but will resort to it if the comments here are not pro 4e conversion.

Thanks,
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Sir Osis of Liver · Post by **Sir Osis of Liver** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 12:41 am

Sir Ironside wrote:
With the advent of the new D&D 4e rules, and there awesome announcement that their next world is going to be Dark Sun- plus the difficulty I have converting systems when I don't have the rules for either of them. I'll leave it to the good people at the TLG forums.

Just how easy do you think one could convert the New Darksun from 4e to C&C?

This is my third favourite setting so if conversion is easy, I'd take a hard look at it. I'm not a whole lot interested in getting the 2e D&D books, but will resort to it if the comments here are not pro 4e conversion.

Thanks,

I think it's way easier to convert to C&C from AD&D 2e than 4e. And there's some great stuff in the 2e books. They're definitely worth grabbing if you can.

serleran · Post by **serleran** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 12:58 am

It is my opinion that, depending on exactly what kind of conversion one wants, nothing is difficult to convert to anything else. Even when a very strict conversion is implemented, all it takes is intimate knowledge of how the two independent systems handle the given situation (or likely would), and then using that... even if it means the exact system is lost.
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Omote · Post by **Omote** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:00 am

Ask Rigon for help by PMing him. He converted a ton of Darksun material to C&C. It's the goods.

~O
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Sir Osis of Liver · Post by **Sir Osis of Liver** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:00 am

serleran wrote:
It is my opinion that, depending on exactly what kind of conversion one wants, nothing is difficult to convert to anything else. Even when a very strict conversion is implemented, all it takes is intimate knowledge of how the two independent systems handle the given situation (or likely would), and then using that... even if it means the exact system is lost.

How to convert standard, minor and move actions to C&C, though? I wouldn't want to begin trying to convert that.

serleran · Post by **serleran** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:06 am

It would be easy enough -- initiative penalties, for starters, as I believe there are limits to how many of each a character can perform in a D&D game. So, assume a round has X # of "points" of actions, and each of these costs Y... done.
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Sir Osis of Liver · Post by **Sir Osis of Liver** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:08 am

serleran wrote:
It would be easy enough -- initiative penalties, for starters, as I believe there are limits to how many of each a character can perform in a D&D game. So, assume a round has X # of "points" of actions, and each of these costs Y... done.

No, those are at-will vs. encounter vs. daily powers. The different kinds of actions are things to be done each round. I guess you could do 3 things per round in a C&C game, but it would start to take away from the flavor of the game.

Sir Osis of Liver · Post by **Sir Osis of Liver** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:08 am

serleran wrote:
It would be easy enough -- initiative penalties, for starters, as I believe there are limits to how many of each a character can perform in a D&D game. So, assume a round has X # of "points" of actions, and each of these costs Y... done.

But I do understand what you're saying. Sorry, I'm a sarcastic bastard tonight.

serleran · Post by **serleran** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:10 am

Like I said before, it would require intimate knowledge of both systems, which I apparently lack regarding the new D&D... and even the d20 stuff has been fading, thankfully.
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Rigon · Post by **Rigon** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 1:22 am

PM me your email and I'll send you my DS Adaptation. I based everything off of the original DS boxed set. You can extrapalate from there or used it as.

R-
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TheMetal1 · Post by **TheMetal1** » Thu Aug 20, 2009 7:26 pm

Over at the Burnt World of Athas (the official fan site to continue the Dark Sun setting after WOTC pulled it) they went ahead and created a bunch of 3.5 stuff for Dark Sun to include the a 3.5 rules update, monster compendiums, and a bunch of supplements. According to the site, at least in regards to the rules:

Quote:
This is a rules conversion only; in order to fully enjoy the Dark Sun setting, you should have access to the Wanderer's Journal or the Wanderer's Chronicle, which are the setting books published in the first and second Dark Sun boxed sets, respectively.

Here is their link: http://athas.org/

Anyway, if you want to Dark Sun it, the 3.5 rules are there and I would think it would be relatively easy to convert to C&C from 3.5, Hope this helps!

James M. Ward · Post by **James M. Ward** » Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:01 pm

All Dark Sun is really is a high level campaign with a desert theme. We can give you that in C&C without having to go to another brand.

James M. Ward

Sir Osis of Liver · Post by **Sir Osis of Liver** » Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:06 pm

James M. Ward wrote:
All Dark Sun is really is a high level campaign with a desert theme. We can give you that in C&C without having to go to another brand.

James M. Ward

I, for one, would love to see something along these lines. Thinking about it a little more, though, I would almost rather see some other niche habitat. Dark Sun, neat as it was, has been done. Why be an imitator when you can be a ground breaker?

Omote · Post by **Omote** » Fri Aug 21, 2009 7:16 pm

DarkSun is all awesomeness. Post-apocalypic, desert fantasy.

~O
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Treebore · Post by **Treebore** » Fri Aug 21, 2009 8:14 pm

Well Rigon has already done most of the conversion work, so just PM him, or me, and get the nice PDF's he did up for Dark Sun and the psionics.
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Lord Dynel · Post by **Lord Dynel** » Sat Aug 22, 2009 2:29 am

Sir Osis of Liver wrote:
I think it's way easier to convert to C&C from AD&D 2e than 4e. And there's some great stuff in the 2e books. They're definitely worth grabbing if you can.

I think my man hit the nail on the head here, and I wanted to quote that before it got lost in obscurity. I think converting 2nd Edition AD&D would be hte way to go, IMHO, unless one wants warlords and dragonborn in their DS campaign. I'm just kidding about that part, but I honestly feel that if you want a good, easy conversion then go 2nd Edition material.

Of course that's all irrelevant if Mr. Ward's going to design a desert-based campaign...

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Post by **finarvyn** » Sun Aug 23, 2009 3:15 pm

James M. Ward wrote:
All Dark Sun is really is a high level campaign with a desert theme. We can give you that in C&C without having to go to another brand.

I wish you would. Having devoured the Tainted Lands boxed setting in the week or so since GenCon, I really appreacite the boxed set type format and hope that TLG does more of this in the future.

As much as I find Dark Sun cool, I would like to see TLG develop and officially market some sort of desert campaign (maybe with psionics) for C&C. I'd buy that over the "other brand" any day!
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Lord Dynel · Post by **Lord Dynel** » Sun Aug 23, 2009 6:40 pm

finarvyn wrote:
As much as I find Dark Sun cool, I would like to see TLG develop and officially market some sort of desert campaign (maybe with psionics) for C&C. I'd buy that over the "other brand" any day!

Indeed.
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Sir Ironside · Post by **Sir Ironside** » Sun Aug 23, 2009 7:37 pm

So, I'm not perceived as a heartless bastard. I'd like to thank Rigon for the files and Treebore for the offer.

The reason I'd rather go the 4e route is it appears as though WoTC is going the 3 book way with each of its settings and it is easier to get the whole thing without having to search for the books.

In other words I'm lazy.

But, if Mr. Ward would make a Desert setting for C&C, well I wouldn't have to worry about the conversion and just buy that which would be totally awesome.
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Post by **finarvyn** » Sun Aug 23, 2009 8:17 pm

Sir Ironside wrote:
In other words I'm lazy.

See, I don't quite get this statement because I think it would be much easier to convert something from 2E to C&C, but would be more complex to convert from 4E to C&C.

AD&D, 2E, C&C, and to some extent 3E are all run with a similar type of mechanic. Some systems are simpler, others more complex, but the heart of each game system is about the same. Some amp up the power more than others, but again the game isn't that different. I would think that one could convert by simply stripping away some of the extras and sticking to the basics.

4E changes the balance by making sweeping changes in how hit points are done, adds in those different frequency powers, and essentially changes the balance of the game entirely. A conversion would have to totally restructure hit points and other parts of the game in order to scale them back to C&C levels. I just don't see how you save any effort by going this route, but maybe I'm just dense.

Anyway, good luck with your project and maybe you'll share once it's done!
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Lord Dynel · Post by **Lord Dynel** » Sun Aug 23, 2009 10:51 pm

I'll be honest, I haven't tried to convert anything from 4e over to C&C. But I have looked at a module and I own the core books (core being the three main books ) and I'm sure I can convert stuff over with a little bit of effort. But I agree with finarvyn in this case - 2nd Edition (and 1st and Basic) seems to be vastly easier to convert. Maybe I'm missing something but I so far have been able to convert monsters and modules on the fly, within moments. I can't say I would be able to do that with 4e material.

Now that's lazy...at least to me.
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Sir Ironside · Post by **Sir Ironside** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 2:24 am

finarvyn wrote:
See, I don't quite get this statement because I think it would be much easier to convert something from 2E to C&C, but would be more complex to convert from 4E to C&C.

Not lazy, as in converting... lazy as in tracking down all the 2e Darksun stuff. Much easier to buy 2 books (*I think one of the three will be a adventure book, which I'm not interested in.) of the 4e stuff than going to eBay or wherever to get the Darksun stuff.

Of, course I'll forgo all that and buy any C&C setting similar to Darksun.
* I really am not all the familiar with what they do with the new 4e books as I'm not interested in 4e.
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Rigon · Post by **Rigon** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 9:56 am

You only need one thing for 2e Dark Sun, The Dark Sun Boxed Set. It's what I based my C&C conversion on. But if all you're looking for is a desert setting, why use DS at all. Just tweak the classes to fit into an arabian style campaign and set it in a desert area. You don't need to convert anything.

R-
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Lord Dynel · Post by **Lord Dynel** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 4:02 pm

I agree with Rigon. I wouldn't bee terribly opposed to an Al-Qadim style style setting, either, in addition (or instead of) to a DS-type. Call me crazy.
I understand what you're saying, though, Iron. If I didn't have access to the stuff (via pdf), buying the 4e stuff would seem like a viable option to me, too.
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Sir Ironside · Post by **Sir Ironside** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 7:00 pm

Lord Dynel wrote:
I agree with Rigon. I wouldn't bee terribly opposed to an Al-Qadim style style setting, either, in addition (or instead of) to a DS-type. Call me crazy.

I'm not all that familiar with Al-Qadim. I know it exists, I kind'a know what it is about, and I do think it is a very cool setting, but around that time I was moving away from AD&D and into other things, like GURPS and The World of Darkness stuff. (For that matter, I know next to nothing about Birthright, which is too bad as I have heard positive things about it, and Dragonlance that I had zero interest in as Greyhawk was always my go-to setting.)

Lord Dynel wrote:
I understand what you're saying, though, Iron. If I didn't have access to the stuff (via pdf), buying the 4e stuff would seem like a viable option to me, too.

Yeah, I'm not into hardcore conversions. I'm more interested in the "fluff" that will be offered, than the mechanics. I just ignore the mechanics and insert either a C&C equivalent or a close approximation of any Classes, Monsters etc. I'd only look at doing a complete conversion if it was integral to the world.

But, again... any kind of C&C Dark Sun/Al-Qadim like setting, I'd be all over. ( Plus my wanting a C&C Planescape setting. )
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Rigon · Post by **Rigon** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 7:23 pm

If you follow the link I provided, you can get all of the "fluff" you need for DS for $20. It meshes with my adaptation and you get everything you need.

R-
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Sir Ironside · Post by **Sir Ironside** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 11:28 pm

Rigon wrote:
If you follow the link I provided, you can get all of the "fluff" you need for DS for $20. It meshes with my adaptation and you get everything you need.

R-

Bookmarked.

Thanks man, I appreciate it.
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gideon_thorne · Post by **gideon_thorne** » Mon Aug 24, 2009 11:36 pm

Sir Ironside wrote:
I'm not all that familiar with Al-Qadim. )

Its pretty cool. I picked it up when it first came out and borrowed a bit here and there when I ran a game or two.
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Rigon · Post by **Rigon** » Tue Aug 25, 2009 12:13 am

Sir Ironside wrote:
Bookmarked.

Thanks man, I appreciate it.

No problem.

R-
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Lord Dynel · Post by **Lord Dynel** » Tue Aug 25, 2009 11:25 pm

Sir Ironside wrote:
[I'm not all that familiar with Al-Qadim. I know it exists, I kind'a know what it is about, and I do think it is a very cool setting, but around that time I was moving away from AD&D and into other things, like GURPS and The World of Darkness stuff. (For that matter, I know next to nothing about Birthright, which is too bad as I have heard positive things about it, and Dragonlance that I had zero interest in as Greyhawk was always my go-to setting.)

I never picked up too much of the Al-Qadim stuff, but I played in a game for a little while and I was very impressed. It was later in TSR's life, and though it seems these days that much of what was released in that time was just to bring in the cash, it does seem like the developers put a decent amount of effort into it.

Sir Ironside wrote:
Yeah, I'm not into hardcore conversions. I'm more interested in the "fluff" that will be offered, than the mechanics. I just ignore the mechanics and insert either a C&C equivalent or a close approximation of any Classes, Monsters etc. I'd only look at doing a complete conversion if it was integral to the world.

But, again... any kind of C&C Dark Sun/Al-Qadim like setting, I'd be all over. ( Plus my wanting a C&C Planescape setting. )

I got ya now. Yeah, that makes sense on the fluff stuff. I'd probably do the same thing if I needed/wanted the fluff. And I agree, I'd love to see some TLG offering in this vein.
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D&D 4e Darksun, C&C conversion?

D&D 4e Darksun, C&C conversion?

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Re: D&D 4e Darksun, C&C conversion?