New Versions VS Originals???

[serleran]

I'd play a game I didn't like just to show off how much I don't like it.
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Serl's Corner

[Lord Dynel]

serleran wrote:
I'd play a game I didn't like just to show off how much I don't like it.

See, and don't think this personally serl, but to me that's kind of a d*ck move. If I'm interpreting it the way you meant it. I mean, hypothetically, you can do as you choose. But I try to think of the other people at the table. Yeah, I'm altruistic like that.
I'll give you an example (a good one because it has both ways of thinking). My lack of love for 4e is well known. About six months after it came out, a player of mine (a very good friend of mine - I'll call him Joe) said he'd like to try it. I (reluctantly) said okay because everyone was flexible when I introduced C&C and when another guy introduced another game. But one guy, who I'll call Tim (a very good friend of mine away from the table also) was vehemently against it. He wasn't playing that "atrocious money-grab of a game!" I reminded him that we let others indulge themselves and it would only be fair, but he was under no obligation. He finally agreed, but said (basically) this, "look man, I'll play, but I'm not going to like it...and everyone at the table will know it, too." He said he's constantly make fun of and deride the rules. I told him that if he was going to be an ass, not to even bother. Luckily Joe changed his mind and decided he didn't want to try it, for whatever reason.

I just think it was wrong of Tim to act that way. Maybe I made him feel obligated, I don't know. I just pointed out a courtesy that we gave a few others. I the end it worked itself out, but I think I would've been pissed (even though I don't like 4e) if Tim had acted that way, had we played. I wouldve felt bad for Joe even though he really didn't know how Tim felt about it. I wouldve felt bad because I could imagine that Joe would be upset that someone was at the table pissed they were playing something he wanted to play.

serl, I know this is hypothetical (and maybe you being your normal, charming, self with that comment, buddy ) but the only thing I can say, and again I mean no offense, is that if you ever get into this position, kindly bow out before you hurt someone's feelings. Especially if the people at the table don't feel the same way and they're your friends.
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LD's C&C creations - the witch, a half-ogre, skill and 0-level rules

Troll Lord wrote:
Lord D: you understand where I"m coming from.

[serleran]

Oh, I wouldn't say anything bad about the game... no, that's childish. Instead, I'd look for every possible loophole and exploit, exploit, exploit. I've seen all kinds of them in "new D&D." That might be why I wouldn't play... it's just too easy to get ridiculous.
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Serl's Corner

[Lord Dynel]

serleran wrote:
That might be why I wouldn't play... it's just too easy to get ridiculous.

I can agree with that.
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LD's C&C creations - the witch, a half-ogre, skill and 0-level rules

Troll Lord wrote:
Lord D: you understand where I"m coming from.

[Piperdog]

You know, I have played game systems I don't particularly care for, but since I play with good friends, we all respect each other. I have always tried to have a good time, be respectful, play the game in the spirit it was intended, and relax.

While we are all addicted to the escapism and virtual lives of high adventure, etc......in the end its about having down time with your buddies or family....and that is far more valuable to me than the game system in question.
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When in doubt as to who is in charge on the battlefield, listen to the man with the bloodiest sword.

[Fiffergrund]

Ooh, an Edition Wars topic.
Traveller summed up my feelings for the "why" of Edition Wars, earlier in the thread. There are a few other concrete reasons as to "why" that merit some discussion.

I used to *hate* the OBHF (One Big Happy Family) philosophy. I still have some personal issues with seeing all RPGers as a single bloc. While I see the benefit of not alienating anyone who shares a love of RPGs, I also know for a fact that there are gamers with whom I will never see eye to eye, in terms of gaming choices, philosophy, and style of play. While we can all be called gamers, we are really very different, and I tend to resist any philosophy (OBHF) that gets preachy in the name of unity. I just don't think it's as simple as that. Gaming tends to attract some very insecure individuals that make this philosophy untenable.

Edition Wars happen when certain gamers stop being content with their games, styles, and philosophies of choice and begin proselytizing. They are a more immature clone of religious/political arguments, where someone believes they know and understand a fundamental "truth" and they feel a compulsive need to force everyone else to know and understand it as well.

Why do these people feel a need to force, shame, intimidate, or bandwagon others into agreeing with them, while alienating and ridiculing those who will not?

A deep-seeded egotistical need to be validated by the group. People like this aren't secure enough in their own views - they need the constant validation of their own ego and the ego of others that the games they enjoy are the "cutting edge" and that they are part of an elite.

These are the same type of people who will wait in line for hours so they can brag on the new iPhone or iPad they just bought, and deride people who use BlackBerry products.

They don't seem to realize they are projecting to the world that they have this huge insecurity, and they are attempting to overcome that security by forcing others to agree or be ridiculed.

I had this problem, once upon a time. Then I woke up, realized that my approach works for me, and I could give a giant slug's spittle what others think of my gaming preferences. If they agree and enjoy them, great. If not, they are free to choose other options.

Now, having said that, routine gripes about a game here or there aren't the problem. Problems occur in one of two ways. Some situations are escalated by zealots that have to defend every perceived slight against their system of choice, no matter how minor. Others are caused when people who reply to blatant falsehoods are drawn into making factual rebuttals that go absolutely nowhere.

The first variety is when someone can't accept gripes as differences of opinion. These people become a Holy Paladin of [Game System], (HPGS) a pseudo-religious zealot, attempting to convince everyone else (and especially himself) that his game/style of choice is really the objective best. Sometimes, a HPGS chooses to cut down other games instead of understanding that different preferences are not equivalent to a personal attack. This is why C&C gets so much grief in other forums. Let's face it, some people just can't handle it when others disagree, and they see a complaint about a game as an attack on their ego.

The second variety occurs when someone makes gross misstatements about a game in the course of criticizing it. Sometimes, people get a little too forceful in the correction, and can't seem to leave it alone thereafter. I too am guilty of doing this. I wasted *way* too much time trying to correct misconceptions about AD&D and C&C, only to realize later that there was absolutely no way I was going to get the offenders to retract their statements. I fell into the classic internet troll trap.

In the end, it's important that false statements be rebutted where possible, if only for the benefit of other readers who are trying to decide for themselves. However, one post, respectfully written, should suffice if the argument is solid. It's important to write it, then drop it, and stop caring what these other insecure people think.

The bottom line is that there is never going to be OBHF of gamers, especially online. It's impossible. Everyone carries their own emotional/psychological baggage that colors their perceptions and emotional reactions to certain types of discussions.

This fact is the reason why we don't trash other game systems on the TLG boards. It's not to try to foster OBHF. It's to acknowledge that it will never happen, and to avoid falling into the traps set by those insecure in their own skins and gaming choices.
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Sir Fiffergrund, Lord Marshal of the Castle and Crusade Society.

He Who Hides Behind The Elephant's Back

[Breakdaddy]

Fiffergrund wrote:
...[SNIPPAGE]...

Psychology 101: Fiffergrund stylee

[Joe]

serleran wrote:
Oh, I wouldn't say anything bad about the game... no, that's childish. Instead, I'd look for every possible loophole and exploit, exploit, exploit. I've seen all kinds of them in "new D&D." That might be why I wouldn't play... it's just too easy to get ridiculous.

That seems the reason why people DO play some games.
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'Nosce te Ipsum' -Delphic Maxim

'Follow your bliss.' -Joseph Campbell

[Treebore]

I think another reason why people do "game discrimination" is finances. They simply cannot afford to get interested in another game, but rather than say, "I can't afford to get into another game system right now," they mask their financial difficulties by creating faults in the game as to why they don't want to play it.

Heck, I do it to a degree today, because there are a lot of RPG's I like, so I buy their books as soon as I can on my budget, even so there are a lot of other RPG's I would like to keep up on, but don't for two reasons, I am already spending too darn much money on RPG's and I already have too many book CASES, not shelves, cases, dedicated to RPG's in addition to the 50 gallon storage bins I have out in my garage full of even more RPG stuff.

So I simply need to stop buying stuff. However, I don't knock a game simply because I need to not buy it. If I don't get it and someone asks why, I'll be honest and say its because I need to spend my money in other ways. Now if I simply don't like a game, I'll say why, and its usually backed up with at least 3 game sessions of play, rather than a simply reading and claiming my all knowing genius tells me how much the game will suck in play.
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The Ruby Lord, Earl of the Society

Next Con I am attending: http://www.neoncon.com/

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[serleran]

Possibly a good point, Tree, but the price of a game can be a fault. Something like Warhammer 40k was an expensive book, and so are all the supplements, at like $40-60 each... and while I have the main rulebook, I do not have anything else for it, simply because it is too damn expensive, and I don't even play the game. If they were even $10 cheaper, I'd be much more interested in them. Some versions of D&D are like this, too... to have a "complete" game, in the sense the publisher intends, you have to purchase something like 10 books, each at $30 (ie, HackMaster 4e) which is an absolutely ridiculous buy-in cost for a RPG -- it makes more sense for a tabletop wargame, like Warhammer, but even then, the cost to play is incredibly high... and that is a fault and restriction.
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Serl's Corner

[Treebore]

serleran wrote:
Possibly a good point, Tree, but the price of a game can be a fault. Something like Warhammer 40k was an expensive book, and so are all the supplements, at like $40-60 each... and while I have the main rulebook, I do not have anything else for it, simply because it is too damn expensive, and I don't even play the game. If they were even $10 cheaper, I'd be much more interested in them. Some versions of D&D are like this, too... to have a "complete" game, in the sense the publisher intends, you have to purchase something like 10 books, each at $30 (ie, HackMaster 4e) which is an absolutely ridiculous buy-in cost for a RPG -- it makes more sense for a tabletop wargame, like Warhammer, but even then, the cost to play is incredibly high... and that is a fault and restriction.

Definitely, if it wasn't for Amazon, eBay, and other places I have found stuff deeply discounted I wouldn't own anywhere near the RPG books I own today. If I was paying full retail for everything I wouldn't even be keeping up on the RPG's I do keep up on.
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The Ruby Lord, Earl of the Society

Next Con I am attending: http://www.neoncon.com/

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[Lord Dynel]

Treebore wrote:
Definitely, if it wasn't for Amazon, eBay, and other places I have found stuff deeply discounted I wouldn't own anywhere near the RPG books I own today. If I was paying full retail for everything I wouldn't even be keeping up on the RPG's I do keep up on.

Indeed. And, as much as I like to support the brick-and-mortars I just can't sometimes when I can get a book up to (and sometimes more than) 50% off. It really does pain me, but I got to think about my budget sometimes.

Fiffergrund wrote:
This fact is the reason why we don't trash other game systems on the TLG boards. It's not to try to foster OBHF. It's to acknowledge that it will never happen, and to avoid falling into the traps set by those insecure in their own skins and gaming choices.

The spirit is willing...but the flesh is weak.
I try not to, I really do. If I'm posting and it's starting to sound like I'm starting to trash it, I try to add a disclaimer of some sort. I try to keep my discussion of 4e limited to comparisons to other systems (ones I like), where I feel 4e falls short. But I do that will other games as well - it's not limited to 4e. But I'm working on getting better about my disdain of 4e. I never mean (and don't think I have) just posted vitriol about it for reason. Usually it's in discussion about some aspect and how it comparess to some other game.
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LD's C&C creations - the witch, a half-ogre, skill and 0-level rules

Troll Lord wrote:
Lord D: you understand where I"m coming from.

[Benoist]

Lord Dynel wrote:
I understand what you said about playing something that you don't like versus not playing at all. I guess I'm a little different in that regard - I'd rather not play something I'm not going to enjoy. 4e for the prime example. If it's that or sitting at home for the evening, I'll take the latter. But we do agree on our limited game time. Which s why I count my blessings that I have a bunch of like-minded individuals at my table - we all like the same games (mostly...there's a few I want to play that I'm slowing coercing them into playing) and prefer to play those over any others. I didn't want to come off as a game snob, it all comes down to, as we both said, playing what we want in the small amount of time we have to play.

That's pretty much what I would have posted as well. Better no gaming than bad gaming. That's really the bottom-line. If I'm not going to enjoy myself, I'd rather do something else. If people around the table are friends of mine, we can always do something else later on together, or play another game we all enjoy together.
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Building: The Tower of St. Makhab - The Medival Eurth

[Traveller]

I've given up on buying new role playing games. I'm only one person, and I can't possibly play all the ones I have now. Of course, there is one exception: DC Heroes. I want a decent copy of the 3rd Edition at a decent price, since all I have right now is a copy of the Batman RPG with a miniature copy of the Powers and Skills book from 1st Edition DC Heroes.

I do think though that I have to look into letting go of some stuff. I simply have too much of it.

Sorry...rambling.
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My small homage to E.G.G.

[Fiffergrund]

Lord Dynel wrote:
Indeed. And, as much as I like to support the brick-and-mortars I just can't sometimes when I can get a book up to (and sometimes more than) 50% off. It really does pain me, but I got to think about my budget sometimes.



The spirit is willing...but the flesh is weak.
I try not to, I really do. If I'm posting and it's starting to sound like I'm starting to trash it, I try to add a disclaimer of some sort. I try to keep my discussion of 4e limited to comparisons to other systems (ones I like), where I feel 4e falls short. But I do that will other games as well - it's not limited to 4e. But I'm working on getting better about my disdain of 4e. I never mean (and don't think I have) just posted vitriol about it for reason. Usually it's in discussion about some aspect and how it comparess to some other game.

I hear you. For my part, whenever I'm tempted, I usually just get an overwhelming feeling of exhaustion and then I say "screw it" and never post what I was going to say.
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Sir Fiffergrund, Lord Marshal of the Castle and Crusade Society.

He Who Hides Behind The Elephant's Back

[Deogolf]

I play OD&D and AD&D because I find nothing wrong with them. I've played them for so long that it's like a good ole friend. I tried 3ed, really didn't find it all that fun for reasons clearly stated by lots of others. I have the basic box for 4ed, but I doubt I'll ever play it - unless someone asks me to play and I'll give it a try. I don't need another rules system - OD&D, AD&D, and C&C fit the bill just fine thank you. I may get some of the adventures if they sound like fun, but I'm not spending a fortune on a new system that I won't play or even DM. I'd rather use that money to try and track down some old miniatures I missed.
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[Lord Dynel]

Fiffergrund wrote:
I hear you. For my part, whenever I'm tempted, I usually just get an overwhelming feeling of exhaustion and then I say "screw it" and never post what I was going to say.

I do that a lot too, Fiff. It usually has to be somthing that I really, really want to comment on for me to put forth the effort of posting. But I do understand the exhaustion part, completely.
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LD's C&C creations - the witch, a half-ogre, skill and 0-level rules

Troll Lord wrote:
Lord D: you understand where I"m coming from.

[Joe]

Treebore wrote:
I think another reason why people do "game discrimination" is finances. They simply cannot afford to get interested in another game, but rather than say, "I can't afford to get into another game system right now," they mask their financial difficulties by creating faults in the game as to why they don't want to play it.

Now if I simply don't like a game, I'll say why, and its usually backed up with at least 3 game sessions of play, rather than a simply reading and claiming my all knowing genius tells me how much the game will suck in play.

I think you may have a point.

But something I buy at whatever cost that never gets used has one word to describe it: W A S T E!

Why sell stuff at such a high marked up value? (Stupid question I know...heres my sign)
When I see a game with a 60-80 dollar price tag I just move on. It obviously was not targeted for the "poor" kid, but rather the full grown man with a job. Deep down inside I am still the kid.

i understand that economy raises the price over time...but why make older versions obsolete? only to force the buyer to buy more.

Sometimes it works and sometimes...well....umm...sometimes...

When i see overpriced games, I see them as something I would not have been able to afford with my paper route.

It was nothing that would have been a part of my life as a kid because it would not have been available to me.

It is nothing close to what D&D was for me as a kid.

Do people with excess REALLY need another form of entertainment?
Or does the kid on the street with a single mother and hand me down clothes needs an affordable tool by which to open their mind and activate their imagination? Do they need a game that will give them everything they don't have in real life (treasure, power, fame, glory, etc)...even if it is in the imagination?

60 dollars games with hundreds of dollars miniature armies were not intended for people such as I, and now that I have the money to afford such, I decide not to.

I go to a different company.

It really is as simple as that for me.

After buying into the game anyway I discovered TLG.

I understand where you are coming from about compensation with bluster, or having an inflated opinion of one's own all knowing genius. as rpgs tend to flirt with such things.
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'Nosce te Ipsum' -Delphic Maxim

'Follow your bliss.' -Joseph Campbell

[Joe]

Sorry, looks like I jacked my own thread somewhat.

I'm asking more about the folks unwilling to try such and such a version due to such and such a reason.

Treebore was on topic, but I took it somewhere else.

I think pricing is a legit concern.

But i also must reflect on self and the motive behind why I refused to play the very same game that this bloke holds as some superior product.

I cannot honestly critisize him if I am guilty of edition bias also.

But I can say that I am playing numerous games with numerous friends while he sits in front of his computer playing virtual 4e.

Who is missing out?
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'Nosce te Ipsum' -Delphic Maxim

'Follow your bliss.' -Joseph Campbell

[serleran]

You. There is a whole virtual world with Mohawk Elves to kill, for the low-low price of $5048489 billion a minute, unless you're an otaku and can sell your e-flesh for mucho dinero. And then, there's 2nd life, and 3d ICQ and, and, and... whatever else there is. Oh yeah, the v-world is just crawling with ways to download celebrities into blank robots (bonus points for knowing that reference.)
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Serl's Corner

[Joe]

Deogolf wrote:
I play OD&D and AD&D because I find nothing wrong with them. I've played them for so long that it's like a good ole friend. I tried 3ed, really didn't find it all that fun for reasons clearly stated by lots of others. I have the basic box for 4ed, but I doubt I'll ever play it - unless someone asks me to play and I'll give it a try. I don't need another rules system - OD&D, AD&D, and C&C fit the bill just fine thank you. I may get some of the adventures if they sound like fun, but I'm not spending a fortune on a new system that I won't play or even DM. I'd rather use that money to try and track down some old miniatures I missed.

Do you play other games?

Have you tried other games?

Of course you do or else C&C would not be in that list.

I don't think there is anything wrong with any game...just a difference in genre, flavor, or feel of the game.

The wonderful thing about games is they can range in complexity and flavor and apparently satisfy various folks for various reasons.

I believe games is an inherent human need.

It may possibly be one of humanity's first form of abstract thought.

Right after the desire to bust your brother over the head.
And Fiff is right...the diversity of different games is what makes gaming so cool. I just wish it was easier to find folks to play. I would refer him to my buddies group but he just doesn't like "Old D&D".

I think some play the system and for them crunchy bits is a plus, when I find the system needs to be in the background as I play out wild fantasies in weird places. Too many rules getting in da way o me gettin my groove on. Then others find those same rules the manner in which they get theirs.
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'Nosce te Ipsum' -Delphic Maxim

'Follow your bliss.' -Joseph Campbell

[cinderblock]

Hey Serl I want my Lucy Liu bot. MMMMMMMM. Kidnappster here I come! That would be Futurama.
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"Ethics are so annoying. I avoid them on principle."-Bucky Katt

"You can wordify anything if you just verb it."-again, Bucky Katt

[concobar]

I like pretty much every game out there.

[TheMetal1]

Just saw part of the Futurama Episode myself.

Oh yeah, and actually it is free to play in the world D&D's MMO - Eberron: Unlimited *(at least levels 1-4) and the same goes with the Warhammer: Age of Reckoning. Speaking of that I actually do enjoy the D&D MMO. I'm more of a casual gamer type, been playing on an off since Fall of 2007. Just recently started with Warhammer.

Fortunately (maybe unfortunately?) I haven't seen any in-game Mohawk elves to kill. They may be out there but my highest toon is only 6th level. Realize though plenty of folks are there running around with variations of Drizzzzzit or Draizit...with mohawks.

Allright enough with the sillyness....

Joe wrote:
What is this business about weighing a game by the contents between it's pages alone?

I think as RPGs evolved were seeing a similiar thing occur that has with any discipline. I use that word specifically. To some it is no longer a hobby or a game. I has become a discipline. One has only to look at the blogs or even the terminology - gygaxian, or vancian magic, etc. This has invited pontification and acadmeia into the game. This is not a bad thing at all. Many of us which played the game as kids still play it 30 years later and it is done to show on one level, that as adults this lovable game of ours has deep merit and thought. Marketing I think has added to this, we're simply borrowing from other hobbies and disciplines to show deepness of the game. Wine testers come up with a means of sharing their reviews by swirling, smellling the cork, etc then sharing this in the niche magazine that caters to those who really enjoy good wine - or simply want to show they can affort it or look cool. The reviews and the blogs end up sounding like a theological debate over a minor issue or several scholars arguing over the intention of shakesphere. The book is what people can get there hands on it is the tangible 'game.' Wine might be easy to test, reading an RPG book vs. extensive play testing is the same. So that's become the standard review. (ok all that was a bit long.)
Is it not the players that breathe life into an otherwise imanimate collection of printed words?

Yes, well actually it was the author(s) who penned it, but yes the CK and PCs are the ones who make it come alive. I'm sure any of us can take 10 page demo version of game and have a great time with it. But because of the evolvement of the hobby, the years of many in it, the expectation of greater quality - more stuff - less errors etc is what many people are going to judge. Your simply saying don't judge a book by it's cover, and in effect it is the spirit of law not the letter (meaning the spirit of the rules in game - not the word for word thing.)
And what is this business with edition wars?

I like what I like and can be adverse at times to new things. Change at the core of it has some element of fear in it. Rather than recoginze that, we tend to lash out in defense. Hence the edition wars (IMHO)
Will OC&C and 4th crusade folks soon be hating on each other too?

Probably not. But I'm old school C&C no new fangled 4th Crusade edition with their fancy pants cover and their evil twisting of the iconic Barbarian and illusionist for me! Give me my old, sort of well worn Yellow Cover - Yellow for Gold that is! So what are some of your thoughts concerning this topic?

Personally, I'd tell the person that I appreciated their honesty and say their welcome back anytime. Maybe when they get a feel for 4e, perhaps they could come and run a game for you and the rest of the group as DM to show you all what's its like.

It's not like your heretic if you do that. Your not betraying anyone or anything. Unless you value RPGs like a religion I suppose. There is no RPG Inquisition that is going to force you to stay with one edition or follow every letter of the rules. or even stay with one game system. I mean hey let's face it, you've got technology evangelists out there. Literally that was a title one of my cousin's husband had working for microsoft. We see the same here with RPGs, though more ofter it is seen as asking you to join the company's 'Demo Team' and get more players 'interested.' Come on you love the game and your trying to convert others to play it. Join the Crusade and all that.

On another note, do you all see MMOs or video games as another edition or simply an extension of the game? Like DDO, Warhammer and Dragon Age.
Why do you think editions bring out the worst in some folks?

Fear and pride.
What do you think about the "I only play such and such a games" mentality?

People like what they like. It takes a lot to change and change is scary. In the case of games, do we really need to change? Really? Personally as a collector, I'm glad I spent some time looking at other games. Some just didn't do it for me, others like C&C spot on.
I find it curious, but the fact that I am guilty makes me ask the what for?

It is ok to feel guilty and I forgive you for edition hatred.

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R is among the most menacing of sounds. Thats why they call it murder, not muckduck. DWIGHT SHRUTE, The Office

[Treebore]

The new Star Wars MMO is looking and sounding absolutely KICK BUTT! I may actually subscribe to that one for myself, the heck with the kids.
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The Ruby Lord, Earl of the Society

Next Con I am attending: http://www.neoncon.com/

My House Rules: http://www.freeyabb.com/phpbb/viewtopic ... llordgames

[Lord Dynel]

Treebore wrote:
The new Star Wars MMO is looking and sounding absolutely KICK BUTT! I may actually subscribe to that one for myself, the heck with the kids.

Bro, I've been following that since October '08 and been waiting, somewhat patiently, sonce then. That game is going to be freaking incredible!
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LD's C&C creations - the witch, a half-ogre, skill and 0-level rules

Troll Lord wrote:
Lord D: you understand where I"m coming from.

[Orpheus]

cinderblock wrote:
Hey Serl I want my Lucy Liu bot. MMMMMMMM. Kidnappster here I come! That would be Futurama.

"I'll never forget you Phillip J. Fry....MEMORY DELETED!"

[Orpheus]

TheMetal1 wrote:
Just saw part of the Futurama Episode myself.

Oh yeah, and actually it is free to play in the world D&D's MMO - Eberron: Unlimited *(at least levels 1-4) and the same goes with the Warhammer: Age of Reckoning. Speaking of that I actually do enjoy the D&D MMO. I'm more of a casual gamer type, been playing on an off since Fall of 2007. Just recently started with Warhammer.

Fortunately (maybe unfortunately?) I haven't seen any in-game Mohawk elves to kill. They may be out there but my highest toon is only 6th level. Realize though plenty of folks are there running around with variations of Drizzzzzit or Draizit...with mohawks.

Allright enough with the sillyness....

Yeah, the Mohawk deal is for WoW.

What DDO servers do you have characters on? I just started my subscription back up whilst I take a summer hiatus from school. We'll have to group sometime.

I am totally a casual gamer. I started in 2007 and I still haven't managed to break 12th level on any character. I just don't play often enough.

DDO is great for casual gamers because you can build a group with the Core Four characters and just A-Team your way through the quests at a leisurely pace. I like to open as many chests as possible and get all of the traps disabled. The game is great for playing with a dedicated group using the same characters every week. It's not as much fun as an in-person D&D game, but it's pretty good for what it is.

My wife likes WoW, but I just find it to be too much of mindless scavenger hunt. DDO is really the only MMO that I like of those which I've tried.

[TheMetal1]

Orpheus wrote:
Yeah, the Mohawk deal is for WoW.

What DDO servers do you have characters on? I just started my subscription back up whilst I take a summer hiatus from school. We'll have to group sometime.

I am totally a casual gamer. I started in 2007 and I still haven't managed to break 12th level on any character. I just don't play often enough.

DDO is great for casual gamers because you can build a group with the Core Four characters and just A-Team your way through the quests at a leisurely pace. I like to open as many chests as possible and get all of the traps disabled. The game is great for playing with a dedicated group using the same characters every week. It's not as much fun as an in-person D&D game, but it's pretty good for what it is.

My wife likes WoW, but I just find it to be too much of mindless scavenger hunt. DDO is really the only MMO that I like of those which I've tried.

All my toons are on the Sarlona server. My old D&D buddy up in Western New York got me into it and I joined up with his Lloth's Children guild - though I'm not really all that much of a guildy. As far as WOW, I somehow missed the whole WOW thing. Tried it out with my podcast co-host on a UK server with the free 2-week thing, but I liked DDO better
I'm with you on not totally rushing through things in the instances. I'll bash all the barrels and vases for loot and look around. Plus get all the kill bags and treasure. Oh as a side note, looks like they'll have Guild Airships and Half-Orcs as a PC race in the next release. That will be rather interesting. Would like to see them incorporate the Changlings race from Eberron, tighten up the prestige class business and maybe get the Druid and Illusionist out there as classes.

Warhammer is pretty fun especially their PvP. The instances they have where you get transported to a battlefield works out well and is pretty balanced. I might try out a subscription to check out other areas. I do dig the background and universe of Warhammer and I think i translates well to the MMO.

My wife plays both WAR and DDO I think though she likes WAR a bit better. Yeah, +1 on gaming, just let me know when your on.

Lord Dynel wrote:
Bro, I've been following that since October '08 and been waiting, somewhat patiently, sonce then. That game is going to be freaking incredible!

Star Wars does look rather interesting, but the sci-fi one I'm waiting for is Warhammer 40,000. Should be another announcement on it this summer.

Oh yeah and for all you casual fans of MMOs (and even you haters out there ) You might get a laugh from this webisode series centered around a group of MMO guild members that actually meet, its called The Guild and they've just announced a 4th Season. You can watch all the episodes (webisodes really) here:
http://www.watchtheguild.com/
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R is among the most menacing of sounds. Thats why they call it murder, not muckduck. DWIGHT SHRUTE, The Office

[Orpheus]

Most of my guys are on Sarlona too. I might have a few friends interested in setting up a once-or-twice-a-week group of dedicated characters if you're interested. It's a great way to ensure that everyone advances at the same pace and that you get a well-balanced group.

I did that with a group a couple of years ago with a group and we racked up on the good loot and XP. Tons o' Fun!